The CWB Association Welding Podcast
The CWB Association Welding Podcast
Episode 195 with Patricia Carr and Max Ceron
The CWB Association had the privilege to attend Fabtech in Orlando, Florida this year. We are bringing you special episodes recorded in person to keep our members on top of what’s new and exciting in the steel and welding industry.
Discover the cutting-edge world of welding equipment and education as Patricia Carr, National Account Manager at Miller Electric, guides us through the innovative integration of Augmented Reality (AR) in welding training. Experience her journey as she shares valuable insights on bridging the skills gap using AR technology to foster muscle memory and technique development. This episode promises to unveil how these advancements offer cost-effective solutions that address the industry's pressing needs.
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Fabtech is North America’s largest metal forming, fabricating, welding, and finishing event! Schedule the next event in your calendar: September 8-11th, 2025 in Chicago, IL. https://www.fabtechexpo.com/
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All right, I can check. Check, I'm good. So I'm Max Duran. Max Duran, cwb Association Welding Podcast, pod pod podcast. Today we have a really cool guest welding podcast. The show is about to begin.
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Speaker 1:This episode is brought to you by our friends at Miller Electric. We're excited to talk to you about their advanced technology training solutions, offering the Augmented Arc, an augmented reality welding tool designed to train and transform welding techniques in an engaging environment. This multi-process welding simulator maximizes students' welding education while minimizing expenses and training time. Maximizes students' welding education while minimizing expenses and training time. In fact, compared to traditional welding education, you can reduce training time by 65% and material and coupon expenses by up to 60%. Not too shabby at all. Train, transform and inspire the next generation of welders with Augmented Arc Head to millerweldscom slash training solutions to discover our full range of education tools. Hello and welcome to another edition of the CWB Association podcast. My name is Max Strawn and I'm here on the floor of Fabtech 2024 in sunny Orlando, florida, in the Miller booth, itw booth, with the wonderful and super talented Patricia Carr, who has been a wonderful friend and associate for a few years.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes. Well, Max, first, thank you for having me, Thank you to CWB for this podcast. Really excited to be here. I mean this Fab Tech this year has been something amazing to look at. So, for those of you who don't know who I am, my name is Patricia Carr, national Account Manager of Welding Education and Workforce Development, been at Miller Electric for six years, and my job is to build welding education programs all over this country. I cover the East Coast and all of the wonderful country of Canada. Thank you.
Speaker 1:So when you're talking about building education, yes. Are you talking about building education for just welding, or the host of things that Miller does?
Speaker 2:So the entire ITW welding portfolio. So when you think about welding, right, there's so many different components, right? So we're talking about training, we're talking about torches, all things welding. That is what my portfolio and what I'm in charge of.
Speaker 1:When you came in, how long have you been there now?
Speaker 2:Six years.
Speaker 1:Six years wow, yeah. Was there already an education program started, or did you kind of bring this in from nowhere?
Speaker 2:so we what we had was products that were sold into education. You see, so a lot of everyone here probably familiar with our augmented reality products, and that product was built for welding education, training, because we know there's a skills gap. So my colleague and I, steve Hedden, when we first joined together ARMS and started that role, we saw initially there was a true market in education and this is why, miller, now we have a full education offer and we're continuing to grow.
Speaker 1:So, when you're looking to develop education, are you looking at high schools? Are you looking at post-secondary, are you looking at codes and standards? What is it that you're trying to aim as an end goal?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we target both secondary and post-secondary. Obviously, depending on the type of institution, they have different goals, but the most important thing for us is to make sure we continue to have growing welding programs, because in order for us to be a great welding manufacturer, we need people wanting to weld, and this is why we're invested into the industry the way we do.
Speaker 1:So do you find it easier or more difficult to try to sell an education program with the equipment you make or without it? Because there's competitors right, Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Great, great question. You know, the biggest challenge in CTE and this is just the kind of the industry as a whole it's money. So, that is the major pain point that we run across with selling it and when we talk about like augmented reality, it's really looking to educate both CTE instructors and the industry on a new way to learn. You know the adaptability of that and what we find the challenge is you take someone who's a 20-year welder, max, who's been doing this thing you know for all these years they know and then you bring in technology.
Speaker 2:You're literally provoking everything that they know. So it's educating right our industry out there, our teachers, to want to adapt and utilize some of the new technology that's available. So that's really the biggest challenge that we see in this space.
Speaker 1:So it's the old people.
Speaker 2:I like to say mature.
Speaker 1:We can be stubborn. We can be stubborn. That's true, but you know, you know, ar is not, I would say, totally new, but it's coming into the space of training now and the biggest thing that I find with ar is the reduction in cost of consumables absolutely right. So when you're looking to develop ar programs like augmented reality right, what are the things that you want to really get across?
Speaker 2:So two things. The first thing, obviously we mentioned money earlier. Right, so to run an effective welding program, you're going to spend money on consumables.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Now introducing some type of augmented reality product to provide training for that student. When that student comes in entry level they're no longer utilizing consumables at the front end of that training. So when you replace that with some form of training solution you're initially saving so much money in the consumable cost. So that's the first thing. The second thing is the muscle memory and technique. You know, as you know, max, welding is muscle memory and technique. That's 80% of it. If you can train students on good habits without burning through consumables, you know, getting them to hold that the MIG gun in the right way and getting that form and get comfortable welding, you get them to do that first before placing them in a traditional welding program excuse me, traditional welding environment. They're going to weld better and in fact we have data to support that. Many programs around the country who have seen students gain the aptitude of welding quicker by utilizing some type of augmented reality product in the beginning of their training portion. So that's what we're seeing and it's been effective.
Speaker 1:When you're writing the curriculum, are you putting in the pieces where you're saying this is lesson one, lesson plan one? Grab the AR machine or the augmented reality machine and work on this. Now Is there the places for it as you learn?
Speaker 2:Well in terms of curriculum. So we offer almost like an open source platform known as OpenBook which you're familiar with.
Speaker 2:And the uniqueness about OpenBook. It's not necessarily a complete scope and sequence but it gives you the components to build a scope and sequence. So you know, every instructor like we talk about has their way of how they're teach. So if you decide you want to start with MIG welding, we have actual courses and e-modules on OpenBook platform for that instructor now who's armed with the information can utilize to support the training on the augmented reality system.
Speaker 1:One of the biggest issues I saw or hurdles or obstacles when I was teaching. I remember when VR first came out was that if you don't have a strategy to implement, it it starts to gather dust Absolutely Right.
Speaker 1:You start wondering well, when do I use it? You know I have 14 students, 12 students or 40 students, right, how do I use one machine? Do I need 40 machines? How do I actually start incorporating this into my normal school, where it wasn't normal normally there before? Right, what advice would you have for an instructor that's looking at this and thinking how do I get this to be part of the cycle?
Speaker 2:No, I mean great question. So a couple of things. The uniqueness about purchasing that Miller product through our distribution channel is that they will come in and now support you with the implementation of that product. So in addition to OpenBook that we offer, we have additional resources to kind of help arm that instructor so it's less scary. Right To integrate that into the curriculum. So yeah, that is a challenge. That is the biggest challenge we see with this technology is integration into welding programs, but we're working through it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, well, the more they get out there.
Speaker 2:I mean the new way of learning. It's here to stay Right. I'm going anywhere.
Speaker 1:Now, this platform has been out for a couple years now.
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:How many iterations in are we now? Is there going to be a new system coming out, or are we just growing on the existing system to get it out there more?
Speaker 2:Great question. So a couple of things Now. We are always looking at new product development opportunities here at Miller. Now the uniqueness about this first of all, we are coming out with a new product, but the software changes that we do make anyone with an existing product will get access to that particular software without any cost.
Speaker 2:So we don't charge additionally for those upgrades because as we get to learn the product, we're continuing to do more VOC, which is voice of customer research. We're going to make that product as realistic as possible so that way that student can understand what welding truly is from a technique standpoint. So to answer your question, yes, I mean we have so much new ideas coming down the pipeline and excited to share it with you when I can.
Speaker 1:Thank you Now? What about the feedback from the instructors?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know what are they saying. They're like okay, I bought your product, brought it in the classroom, we're putting it down, I'm incorporating it. What are they saying back to you about the product? Do they give you, like all the yeas, also some of the nays, yeah.
Speaker 2:So our process, our CBI process, which is known as customer back innovation, it is required for us to do a lot of voice of customer research. So, to your point, you know we have these I want to say think tanks that we do, and we have a select group of instructors around the country who would come in test our product, give us real-time feedback on what it's doing, what it's not doing, and then we now, as a manufacturer, develop a strategy around making sure that this product is serving our customer. So every update that you see in an augmented arc, a mobile arc or even a live arc has been backed by some type of customer feedback. It's not a bunch of engineers sitting in a room thinking about the new, sexiest and latest thing.
Speaker 2:Everything comes directly from the customer and we build it out on the product to serve you guys.
Speaker 1:And in the segments of education, you have the one-week classes of the camps, then you have like six classes, two year courses, right, which are the ones that are kind of adopting this most.
Speaker 2:So we see a range. You know, because here's the thing about any training solution, it can fit in multiple spaces. You know it has. So you have the first piece about recruitment. But in terms of like that short six-month program, a lot of times those programs are introductory, so we'll we'll see how the, the augmented or even the mobile arc system can be utilized there to just get students a feel for welding. Um, but also at the post-secondary level, you think about, you know, the lincoln techs of the world who actually train welders. They become certified once again. They're utilizing that to introduce welding to those that are new and so that student can now have aptitude quicker, because those programs sometimes are like a nine-month run right.
Speaker 2:They need you to get it fast because their job is to place you in a job. So we've seen it being utilized in so many different types of programs and it all depends on what the goal is, but it can serve it multiple purposes do you see this as mainly uh secondary or tertiary resource, or do you see it as making someone actually industry ready? Great question. That's some good questions, okay. So this is where I see this fitting. I'm going to tell you why it's both.
Speaker 2:Now in terms of the secondary and the post-secondary piece because of the tremendous consumable savings, and budgets are always strapped right, especially within the public education sector. I see this playing well there. Now, when you talk about advanced welding engineering programs, right, a lot of times they don't have as many physical welding um spaces to do. It's very small, so something like this that doesn't need a traditional lab, you don't?
Speaker 3:need film extraction. Exactly runs on 110.
Speaker 2:This is where we see that this particular type of um simulator work effectively. So, to answer your question, I see it working in both environments.
Speaker 1:Now, do you think that a shop would? Want one Like is there a place for it, say for commercial industry, to say maybe we should all have an AR machine so if one of our fresh new employees is struggling, instead of burning plate, we can get them to practice on this in the afternoon? Or I'm just thinking like is there other roles that this type of technology might sneak into?
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, I definitely can see it in shops because it comes down to cost.
Speaker 2:I think, one of the major pain points that this technology really supports is saving on consumables. So for that shop you know person who owns a shop who has a bunch of employees, someone may be screwing up the wells you get them back in an AR machine, let them to get that right. And then now that shop is saving money and you know, and a lot of times time is money in those environments there's an order that's in. They got to fulfill that order.
Speaker 2:So, you know, that's where I see that that particular machine working well for them.
Speaker 1:You know, in Canada, the foundation, the CWB foundation, we've purchased a number of your machines. We're using them across Canada through camps and to mainly for recruitment purposes. Right, one of the things that we found is the most interesting is that it's kind of a gamification right because you get the students in and they start getting competitive with each other absolutely about. You know the score and how they do and how good it looks. Is there, uh, uh, an aspect of the machine software going forward that might capitalize on that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, I think in the time we're living in now, where technology is every student's friend right in terms of young people we are definitely looking at to benefit us from an industry standpoint. So I'm going to say, yes, you know, but there has to be a balance. So we're all about making sure that this is as realistic as possible, right? So we don't want to create a great game but really doesn't prepare that student for that real environment.
Speaker 2:So we're constantly making sure that that balance stays in place, but yeah, and how do you make it so real? Right Like.
Speaker 1:I'm sure there's a bunch of really intelligent engineers and designers and stuff. But you know, when you're looking at it, you put on the helmet and it's augmented reality. You still see things, you're still there, but then all of a sudden there's a weldment in front of you, right, and you get to weld. You know, and you have these controllers and these cool pieces. Is there a fear of that tech from instructors? Do you think sometimes it could be overwhelming?
Speaker 2:Absolutely. And, as I mentioned earlier, I think that train the trainer piece is, you know, it's really important in this type of technology. And here's the thing, if the instructor is not comfortable with the product, he's not going to use it.
Speaker 1:He's not going to use it. And how can?
Speaker 2:he, it won't be a teaching tool, you know, and that's to your point. It'll take up dust in a corner, in a classroom.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no-transcript guys supplying machines, giving us a great deal because you have like, uh, you know you have a discount or promotions for education and for stuff like that. Then we have the schools and then we have us as the association kind of being the third piece. That seems to be a fairly successful model. Is that happening in the US? Are you having associations stepping in and helping the schools that are underfunded get these products in the door, or how are you getting them into the schools if they can't afford it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, great question. So there are a few layers that are happening Now in terms of the North America market. Oftentimes schools are successful by writing grants and so what we have done at ITW Welding, we've built a grant assistance writing tool to now arm schools who want to have this technology in their programs to understand these are the components of a successful grant. So we've spent money and resources to kind of lay that out for the school, because a lot of times there are no resources in that area.
Speaker 2:So that's one piece in terms of funding. You know another thing you know we have Perkins funding that comes down from the federal government.
Speaker 2:A lot of times we'll see schools utilize Perkins funding to buy this type of technology, and then we have other streams, like there's private philanthropists that come out and provide support for funding. So you know there are different areas to do that. And to your point about the challenges with affording this type of technology, I think it's important for us as a organization to continue to provide more resources to educators so that way the money doesn't become a challenge.
Speaker 2:And we're doing that, and we're continuing to do that research now in terms of partnership yeah you know, do you look at establishing long-term partnerships with with schools?
Speaker 1:so you know, they buy five. Five years later they can buy the new five. How can you keep the new tech in the school?
Speaker 2:great question. So new technology, there's a few things. So those schools who have purchased the product already a lot of times.
Speaker 2:Those are easier because they know the power of the product. So we can come back to them and say, hey, this is a better version of what you have, so we've seen that being effective. But another way to keep these products in the schools is data to support the impact of those products, because, you know, anyone can come out with a nice product. But the question is what is the true impact or the ROI for the program? And so we are investing money into research to support these types of products, because we want educators to make an informed decision, and administrators from all over this country and in Canada, and it's important for us as a manufacturer to provide all of the data so that way the customer can be informed. So that is the way.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you know we're in, we're wealthy countries right, we're in north america like we struggle, we have our pain points but at the end of the day, we're fairly wealthy countries absolutely is this technology?
Speaker 1:does it have a place in other countries that have much less resources? Like, do you see it like? I worked in africa for a while, you know, and it was budgets. You know we complain about budgets here, but you go there and you're like, oh my goodness, right, I could see these tools being so valuable in remote locations of our own countries.
Speaker 1:Indigenous cultures you know, do you see a place for it there, like on a purely, I guess, uh, you know, uh, what's the word I'm looking for? Like from a goodwill point, or even workforce development, right, right, yes absolutely so, 100%.
Speaker 2:You know, I think and this is for every company in this space I often challenge even my organization to think about the market differently. Right and welding is not just a North American issue. It's a global issue. So I definitely believe that these products have a space there. We all know that. You know it's money, that money that moves this.
Speaker 2:But I believe you know, as we continue to have different initiatives around the country, around this kind of global shortage, more of these conversations will continue to happen and and we're willing to have a seat at the table with that you know like there's an organization, LIFT, that we work with and they're just recently expanded into Puerto Rico.
Speaker 1:Oh cool.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so you know we're already in talks about a partnership to implement there and to support, you know, their workforce development efforts. So we're definitely doing what we need to do on our part, but I definitely think there's more work to be done to answer your question.
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Speaker 1:And we're one of them. Right, there's lots of people getting into the game and it's not an easy game to get into, no, so you know how do you temper those expectations or try to come out ahead.
Speaker 2:So you know we're not in the curriculum business but I can speak for in the welding business. One of the how we keep ahead of the competition, I believe one of our strengths is that CBI process, that customer back innovation, because it doesn't stop right.
Speaker 2:So you can come out with a great product and because you have great sales. Sometimes you can take a step back and say, hey, this is working. But we are always challenged by leadership here at ITW Welding to continue to see what's next. What's that next greatest thing? How to take this product to the next level. What are customers also complaining about? And I mean nothing gets thrown in the garbage. We prioritize through our 80-20 process, you know.
Speaker 2:But sometimes we go back to the 20s and look at, hey, is there a potential 80 there? Right that where we can build out and support our customer.
Speaker 1:It wasn't the right time, but now it is, I'm like.
Speaker 2:AR, I mean a couple years ago. Someone probably would have laughed at you you know, about it, and now it's the right time.
Speaker 1:So yeah, now in terms of future development. You know, where do you see this in five years? If you look at the five, the last five years, and how it's moved forward, is there a top. You know, like you come to fabtech every year and you're like there can't be something new. There's so many new things and then you see more new things, right. So what's the what's next on the horizon for for the education pieces?
Speaker 2:yeah, I think collaborative robots. Oh, I think that's where I mean look around us here, everywhere, everywhere.
Speaker 1:I feel like a robot show all right so I believe collaborative I'm actually a robot. I sorry, that's why my voice is so weird, yeah.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah. So I believe that you know robots is going to be kind of the future in this welding space. You know a lot of times like you look at, you know companies that have a lot of repetitive wells. You know the cobot system does well there because you can literally code that system one time and it's going to get it right every single time the robot can't catch covid or need a day off, you know or lose its voice so I believe that's where the future is going in, and and I would even take it a step further where, when we can combine ar technology with some type of collaborative piece, to support training in this area.
Speaker 2:That's where I believe, know this industry is going to go, because we can't produce enough welders.
Speaker 3:That's just a fact.
Speaker 2:So companies have to be unique to right fulfill that workforce, and so collaborative robots are going to be here to stay, I think. I believe they're going to continue to grow and I believe training programs around the country are going to have to adapt to that. Laser welding, you know, is another one Right, right.
Speaker 1:So that's where we're going, but these are all new price tags. Absolutely that we got to somehow get to schools to pay for, and that's where I just I wish all these toys were in the schools. You know, like if the students could see these things, they could take it to the workplace and be like I'm comfortable with it, I know how to use it. Let's go with it right, right, but we don't see this. You guys are doing it to support welding but, like you said, how are we getting this to the co-bots?
Speaker 2:I was into cnc cutting and lots of these pieces of equipment are expense right yeah, no 100, so I believe exposure is so one of the things that is awesome about our organization. We have tech centers all over the country and whenever we can, we would definitely invite schools out to the tech centers, right, just so they have an experience with something new.
Speaker 2:And that I mean, the only cost for the school is to get the students there. But we're happy to have our staff kind of go through and have this student have a touch and feel and kind of get under the hood of some of the new technology and I think that's where we can start to plant some seeds. And you know, as I continue to travel the country, it's working with key organizations in this space to get education to start to think differently about this and you know someone like myself in this role and my colleagues us kind of being the front runners of this.
Speaker 2:You know, speaking to these entities, you know you talk about Perkins and, like the ACTEs of the world, making sure that they continue to advocate for funding for new technology. You know, keeping that top of mind because we're working with the John Deere's of the world, we're working with the Caterpillar's of the world, and these are great companies.
Speaker 1:Huge manufacturing companies. Yeah that students will be working at. So finding that balance, you know, between the two is what we continue to work towards. Those partnerships you're talking about these big companies. Yeah, do they help getting your message out? Do they bring it into their companies? Are they out there flogging for you?
Speaker 2:guys like, yeah, you know and and, as I mentioned earlier, the augmented reality piece, like a John Deere, for example. They'll utilize it for recruitment and different forms and I believe, because companies like that are adapting to this type of technology.
Speaker 1:It gives a lot of eyes on it. It gives a lot of eyes on it and the schools are more open to it, right?
Speaker 2:Because, hey, if my employers are utilizing it, maybe this is something we should be utilizing it in our program.
Speaker 1:So that's where kind of that informal partnership I should say is happening. You know, within the industry, when you come to fab tech, yeah you know, and you're bringing the ar systems out here what is it that you're hoping to gain at a specific show like this?
Speaker 2:so feedback yeah you know um, interest is always there. You know give or take, but getting that person to experience you know the technology, sometimes we. You know give or take, but getting that person to experience you know the technology. Sometimes we get you know instructors who haven't had a demo or haven't experienced it, getting them under the hood, exposed to it, carrying that initial thought on hey, do you think this can be a tool that you can utilize in your classroom? What are the barriers for you to get it right? And constantly doing that voice of customer research. That's where we really do well here at Fabtech.
Speaker 2:And, of course, our distributor partners, which you know we sell through distribution all of them are here, so it almost becomes a think tank in a room as well, on how we can continue to kind of grow, you know, as a manufacturer. So those are kind of the two things I'll say that we look for here at Fabtech.
Speaker 1:And have you seen a lot of growth in your AR world? Oh, absolutely.
Speaker 2:I think it's almost shocking honestly yeah, you know it's funny, because when I first joined ITW this was a $3 million business. You know, my colleague and I were able to grow exponentially from 3 to 10 million in five years, nice, and when you think about that number, you know it's like, wow, how many machines is that?
Speaker 1:How many pieces is that Give or take? Don't have me do math on camera.
Speaker 2:Max, I was talking to Jeremy before this. I think he said about almost 300 augmented arts that we sold this year, you know, and that's like the Mercedes-Benz of the portfolio if I could say that.
Speaker 2:So it's doing pretty well, and I think there's more to do, and as we continue with our customer-backed innovation process, I mean our product development team and shout-out to Jeremy for watching is doing a great job, you know, in terms of making sure we look at what's new, because we don't want to be great. We want to be great now, now, but we want to also be better you know, in the future. So keep moving forward, because there's a lot more to do to impact the industry.
Speaker 1:So and you talked about how this is like the ferrari of your, of your gear. Yes, what are the other levels? How many versions do you have? What's the difference.
Speaker 2:Okay, so we have three versions of training solutions within the portfolio. So walk, walk with me guys, okay, so think of this as cars. So the first one is the mobile arc system which is here displayed on the desk. Here I call that the Toyota version of the product. That's a MIG-only quarter-inch steel welding AR tool tabletop really lightweight, under 10 pounds, really targeted towards that middle school market and also high schools and also recruitment schools and also recruitment events for post-secondary.
Speaker 2:That's where we see that quick and easy, ready to go, don't have to be a welder to turn it on, you know. And then the next one is the augmented arc, which is what which I mentioned before. That's our mercedes-benz virgin. That is a true multi-process augmented reality welder. You can change the type of process, the type of materials you weld with. I mean there's a work stand you can do overhead welding. I mean the range is amazing.
Speaker 2:You get the full, you know WPS functions in that system. And then we have the LiveArc system, which I call the Rolls-Royce of the product line, and that one gives you the best of both worlds. You have that motion tracking system blended with a live welding environment so that school doesn't lose a boo, because we know real estate is a challenge, you know and a welding program. So you get the best of both worlds, where now you have a system that you can train on and also a system where that student can actually weld on in a live welding environment. So that's kind of the difference between the tiers, and each one of them um has a different purpose purpose.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know audience.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, so that, thank you our audience for sure, and at the end of the day it also comes down to price.
Speaker 1:So yeah, do you think that a good program? Let's say, I'm a school yeah reach out to patricia and I say, okay, I got some money from the government. I want to put together a program. Right? Do you say two of these, one of those, one of those or just five Rolls Royces, or am I buying a fleet of Toyotas Right?
Speaker 2:right? No, so great question. So when you reach out to myself, I am interested in making sure you have the right tools for your program. It's not about me selling you the most expensive type of equipment, because what is our goal, right?
Speaker 2:We're here to support the health of the welding industry, and you need to be empowered in a position where you can not only buy the training solution but you can buy the things you need for your traditional welding program as well, like consumables. So, taking a look at the program, looking at, you know what exactly are you trying to teach from a process standpoint, because, depending on where you are in the country, it will differentiate with the type of welding that's really done there.
Speaker 2:So we definitely take more of a customized approach when we look at that and once we take a look and understand that curriculum we will make recommendations for you. And then also classroom size plays a portion of that as well.
Speaker 1:Now what if industry reaches out and said we're a mining company, we have our special WPSs for mining Right. Can you create for us programs for AR that we have in our local school, so that those kids can come out already knowing how to do what we do with the mine? Is that a thing?
Speaker 2:Ah, great question, and you look like you're in my CBI process. I'll leave it right there. But, yeah, let's just say that there's power in software and a lot can be done, and so how you're thinking about going to industry, finding out what exactly they need, creating the product to meet the industry demand that is exactly what this particular portfolio can do.
Speaker 1:All right, and have you done that with anybody?
Speaker 2:So we have come up with like custom coupons in the past. You know, and we still do, the.
Speaker 1:CWB is different than aws right.
Speaker 3:So yes, so it can be done yes, and we have done it yeah, cool yeah where's the biggest uptake so far with the systems?
Speaker 2:so when you say uptake, expand that for me a little bit like who's buying the most right now?
Speaker 1:high schools, post-secondary associations. Who's kind of helping you guys move them up?
Speaker 2:I will say post-secondary, and honestly it's only because of budgets. They tend to have a larger budget than the the k-12 space. So we got high schools that want it. But you know, sometimes there's some other challenges that that stand in the way. But post-secondary would be the 80 of what we focus on, to be honest, and what are the 20s, who are the 20s right the the high school program um, and and when are the 20s? Who are the 20s?
Speaker 1:right, the high school programs.
Speaker 2:And when I say 20s it doesn't mean they're less significant, but it's just there's more barriers to purchase. So, it would take someone like myself to provide the grant writing resources. You know work with that customer a little bit more.
Speaker 3:Connect them with another group, connect them with another group.
Speaker 2:I mean, I've even seen this power in districts, right so, where the district will purchase a system and they would almost do like a library set up where every particular school will have it at a certain period of time. I've done that and that has been effective. So thinking about unique ways of how to buy the system and have that technology in the classroom is where we will kind of help support, you know, some of those efforts.
Speaker 1:What about the new welding processes coming up? Laser welding, I'm sure Miller's going to be. Have you guys gone itw? Does it have handheld laser?
Speaker 2:oh, we do, we do, so, is that?
Speaker 1:is that represented on the augmented yet?
Speaker 2:not yet. Yeah, not yet, but we do have it. We partnered with ipg and we have a laser welder, the opt x. Definitely check it out. Yeah, for sure, we have here on the floor.
Speaker 1:What about?
Speaker 2:cutting. Yeah, that's another area. I mean, here's the thing right, the entire portfolio is always looking to grow.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Now, from an AR standpoint, we're always looking to find to build, you know, training tools to support what's being used. But the 80, based on our research is the actual welding. That is the toughest piece. That's where we spend most of our time, exactly so we're going to focus a lot of our efforts here. It doesn't mean we won't do some of the other things, but that's kind of where the customer is telling us they need the most help.
Speaker 1:And you said, the curriculum that you have supports the machine.
Speaker 2:From an instruction standpoint. From an instruction standpoint.
Speaker 1:Could an instructor in theory theory run a course with the augmented arc and your guys's curriculum front to back?
Speaker 2:so we do have some of the the open book modules that are available to be viewable within the augmented arc system. To answer your question and we have some other curriculum companies that we've partnered with that where you can actually do some of their curriculum on the augmented system so cool we, we have the capability and and more can be done in that area yeah sure, I guess there's no limit, right there's no, I mean software yeah, yeah, you know, that's the beauty about software you can do a lot now with the machines themselves.
Speaker 1:You know I've seen lots of different kinds here, with the helmets right, the handhelds. There's so many different systems. Which ones do you think the kids like the most? Do they like having the helmets on? Do they like the quick in and out? What do you see them interact with the best?
Speaker 2:They like the helmet.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:It gives them a more submerged feeling in the environment and also it feels more realistic, because when you're welding, you're going to wear a helmet.
Speaker 1:Yeah, can you make it burn you? Can you make it throw sparks at you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm sure we would love to be able to do that, but I'm not sure. Or the smell.
Speaker 1:You know, have the smell of welding come out. I love that smell.
Speaker 2:Not yet, not yet, not yet. Maybe on the horizon, but the most important thing like I said they're getting that muscle memory, you know and technique. But yeah, the helmet is where it wins with the students. They like putting that helmet on, adjusting it. They love the feel of that.
Speaker 1:When you're walking around the show here in Orlando and you see so much technology, so many new things coming up, even with yourselves showing up all the new stuff, how does that empower your thinking as a leader in education for the next generation of products?
Speaker 2:Honestly, it's very thought provoking and for me I go back to the same point. Look at what we're doing, how we continue to grow and not only following just the trends, but taking the trend to the next level, right where we can be leaders. So I walk around this room like I tell you, this feels like the robot show right Like it's automation at its finest.
Speaker 2:I think we now are charged as manufacturers who do well in building big blue machines is to really invest in the automation space. I mean, I remember I was at a conference earlier this year and they talk about automation is, I mean, a billion-dollar industry and we're behind and we are behind and we're behind right. So I mean you take myself at Miller, I mean any of my other competitors. I think we're all being challenged now onto rising into the occasion.
Speaker 1:So that's what this type of show does for me personally is to make sure we're always ahead of the game in technology and also engaging in technology well, and I've seen in the last decade of fabtech how much more competition has entered into the room right, it used to be 20 30 companies. Now we're looking at 150, 200 companies. And how do you stay ahead of the competition? That's a that's a tough one.
Speaker 2:I mean listen you know we're made here in the US. I think that's a value for us being here. Another thing is we have been doing this a lot longer than many other people right so you take a company that knows welding, understands it, understands safety around that, and then now looking to adapt and add technology to that, we're going to produce a better product than those that are just tech companies right, trying to build a welding product, yeah, so that's where I think we differentiate in the market, and our product has proven that.
Speaker 1:There's a trust factor too, Absolutely the brand awareness.
Speaker 2:I mean, we've been out here for 90 plus years.
Speaker 1:I mean it's not our first rodeo, yeah, and most welders are going to be used to using some type of Miller machine within their career and if you're old enough, you weld it on Hobarts and the consumables and all the pieces of that. So there is that brand recognition that I think goes both ways too, because, as young students, if you're on the AR machine and it's Miller machine, you're going to be like I like Miller, yeah, no, you're going to be like I like Miller, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, you're right and to your point. This is why we're so intentional with supporting schools, because if you've trained on a Miller, you're going to buy Miller in your garage, that's right, that's what you're comfortable with, and we have studies to prove that you know, so that's why we're focused here. We have to invest in it. This is the way to go to stay relevant, you know.
Speaker 1:So last takeaways here you know what would you like people to know? You know for yourself about the AR system If you're an instructor listening to this or you're curious about it, but you're not able to come to these wonderful shows.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 2:You know what can you tell them about? You know how to look into it, what to think about. Well, I'll say this Don't look at the limitations of the finance to be the barrier to actually you know engage in this technology. We have an awesome distribution channel and nine times out of 10, you're buying gas from someone and that's an authorized Miller distributor.
Speaker 2:I will encourage you to go forward and reach out to your distributor. Talk to them about augmented reality, ask for a demo. You know we empower our channel, which are partners for us, like within our business, to come out and provide the demo, support you on onboarding onto that product, and also we have some curriculum tools to support that. So I just want the instructor out there to know this Don't allow money to be the barrier for your students to experience what's coming. You know, get in contact with Miller. We're here to support you. We have resources here for you, and the last thing I'll say is we are here and we're dedicated to this space. So just know that you have a partner in us and you know we're here to help.
Speaker 1:That's awesome because you know financially people get scared.
Speaker 2:Oh, I understand. You know I was in that seat in my previous job.
Speaker 1:I was an instructor too, but now on the other side, I also know that there's a lot more people out there to help you than you realize. And if you come up with a game plan and you say I want this and you got to just figure out how to get it, you already know you want it. If you start asking the right questions, you'll figure it out, you'll find the funding, you'll do the applications, you'll reach out to the groups and you'll find those pieces you need to get it into your school.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, and don't be afraid of a crawl, walk, run, approach right. So, you may not be able to come in and afford, like five systems, that's okay. If you can afford one this year and continue to build on that, at least you're getting some form of new technology in your classroom. So when your student gets on the floor or wherever the case is, they're better. So take that approach. I mean I encourage it, I've done it my own way and how can people see it online?
Speaker 1:Where do they go?
Speaker 2:How do they find information? Yeah, so check out milloweldscom forward slash education. We have all of our products there. Also, we have a great resource page as well, where you can see some of our grant writing assistance tools. We have some other details about how to start a welding program and things like that, because we know that's always a challenge for that product, knowledge and a few other things. So check us out, you know, and a lot of it is free. I mean, we even offer PowerPoint online.
Speaker 1:I've used them. I've used them Awesome, right, because you're always looking for things for lesson plans as an instructor, so that's available to you.
Speaker 2:You know, we're really looking to remove the barriers to the technology. You know, and we're always looking to build tools in that area.
Speaker 1:It's interesting to see what's going to be next.
Speaker 2:I'm telling you I'm excited too.
Speaker 1:And we got a sneak peek, oh I don't know.
Speaker 2:I have to see if I trust you. No, I'm kidding, but it's going to be cool. It's going to be cool, is it going?
Speaker 1:to be next Fabtech.
Speaker 2:I can't make that promise I can't make that promise, but I can say that what we're coming to do is to solve big problems in the welding space and we have the instructors at the forefront. It's not us just trying to sell.
Speaker 1:We want to make your life as an industry, so that I can say Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Patricia for being on the show. It's always fantastic and I'm sorry about my voice but you know I've been working so hard.
Speaker 2:You're working hard, man.
Speaker 1:Definitely All right. Any shout-outs you'd like to say? Karina, arion and Jorge?
Speaker 2:and Jessica Marhefky, who leads that group. Thank you for what you do and let us continue to be well, Awesome, Well you heard it here.
Speaker 1:You know Patricia, who's been wonderful for many years with me, and then the education team at CWB, and you know they're always supporting us. We use CWB and you know they're always supporting us. We use a lot of these machines. We have them across Canada. So if you want to try out an augmented reality machine, reach out to the CWB Association in Canada. We can get one into your local school on a try out basis for a week or a couple days. We can bring it to you, show you it and let you see what it's like and then connect you if you want to buy one. So let us know. You know we're also in the US. We can maybe do some helping to you. But make sure you check out all these podcasts here at Fab Tech and I'll see you at the next episode. All right, so take care.
Speaker 3:We hope you enjoy the show you've been listening to the cwb association welding podcast with max. If you enjoyed what you heard today, rate our podcast and visit us at cwbassociationorg to learn more. Feel free to contact us if you have any questions or suggestions on what you'd like to learn about in the future. Produced by the CWB Group and presented by Max Holm, this podcast serves to educate and connect the welding community. Please subscribe and thank you for listening.