The CWB Association Welding Podcast
The CWB Association Welding Podcast
Episode 197 with Josh Brewster and Max Ceron
The CWB Association brings you a weekly podcast that connects to welding professionals around the world to share their passion and give you the right tips to stay on top of what’s happening in the welding industry.
Step into the fascinating world of welding with our special guest, Josh Brewster, the Associate Dean at SAIT's Aviation and Technology Department. Josh takes us on a journey from his humble beginnings in Saskatchewan to his influential role in Alberta, sharing how a high school welding class in Okotoks sparked a lifelong passion. Through personal stories of skills competitions and apprenticeships, Josh emphasizes the importance of safety in trades and the role of mentorship in shaping his dynamic career. His insights offer a compelling look at the balance between hands-on experience and academic growth in the welding industry.
Follow Josh:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/josh-brewster-0297547b/
Thank you to our Podcast Advertisers:
Canada Welding Supply: https://canadaweldingsupply.ca/
Miller: https://www.millerwelds.com/products/augmentedarc
Canaweld: https://canaweld.com/
There is no better time to be a member! The CWB Association membership is new, improved and focused on you. We offer a FREE membership with a full suite of benefits to build your career, stay informed, and support the Canadian welding industry. https://www.cwbgroup.org/association/become-a-member
What did you think about this episode? Send a text message to the show!
All right, I can check. Check, I'm good. So I'm Max Duran. Max Duran, cwb Association Welding Podcast, pod pod podcast. Today we have a really cool guest welding podcast. The show is about to begin.
Speaker 1:Attention, welders in Canada looking for top quality welding supplies, look no further than canada welding supply. With a vast selection of premium equipment, safety gear and consumables, cws has got you covered. They offer fast and reliable shipping across the country. And here's the best part all podcast listeners listeners get 10% off any pair of welding gloves. Can you believe that? Use code CWB10 at checkout when placing your next order. Visit canadaweldingsupplyca now. Canada Welding Supply, your trusted welding supplier. Happy welding.
Speaker 1:This episode is brought to you by our friends at Miller Electric. We're excited to talk to you about their advanced technology training solutions, offering the Augmented Arc, an augmented reality welding tool designed to train and transform welding techniques in an engaging environment. This multi-process welding simulator maximizes students' welding education while minimizing expenses and training time. Students welding education while minimizing expenses and training time. In fact, compared to traditional welding education, you can reduce training time by 65% and material and coupon expenses by up to 60%. Not too shabby at all. Train, transform and inspire the next generation of welders with augmented arc Head to millerweldscom slash training solutions to discover our full range of education tools.
Speaker 1:Hello and welcome to another edition of the CWB Association podcast. My name is Max Teran and, as always, I am out there scraping and digging and looking for the best talent I could find to bring on the podcast. Today I have the privilege of bringing on a good friend of mine, someone that I've known for years now in and out of the industry, and an ambitious, fantastic man that I've met, josh Brewster. How are you doing, my friend?
Speaker 2:I'm doing well. Thanks, Max. Thanks for having me on today.
Speaker 1:I appreciate it. I've been waiting for the right time. You could have been on this podcast 10 times by now with the career you've had and all the zigs and the zags that you've taken over the last decade.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely, it's been a dynamic 15 or so years. Yeah, it's been an interesting ride, to say the least, for sure you bet.
Speaker 1:So, josh, you are the Associate Dean at SAIT for the Aviation and Technology Department, correct? Yeah, yeah, I am Yep. And but, more importantly, because this is how we met right at the start, you're a welder. I am yes, right, right. So let's go right to the beginning. Like, where were you born? Where's your roots? Tell us about the origins, origin story of Josh.
Speaker 2:Sure, max. So I'll start somewhere close to home for you. So I'm originally from Saskatchewan, so I was born in Prince Albert and I had my first years out there. My family owned a small business and we actually owned a trailer park for a period of time and I grew up there on a small acreage. When I was just in grade one we moved to Alberta. My dad saw opportunity out here in Alberta, like a lot of people did, and he made the decision to move the family out here and I took my grade school just south of Calgary, in Okotoks, and that that was pretty uneventful, honestly, played some sports I know you and I were just chatting about hockey and got into high school where I didn't really have a clear path forward.
Speaker 2:I had a lot of friends, I had a lot of fun, but coming out of grade 10 and going into grade 11, there wasn't a clear path for me. My family wasn't really big on university or post-secondary in general. We were hardworking people with small businesses, construction, you know, heavy equipment, all that sort of stuff and I really appreciated those roots and I had no real intentions on going into any type of post-secondary at all. I guess the path really changed when I was, I believe, in grade 11. I was looking for courses to fill my course load in high school, and I was looking for things that were different than your big four, your English language, your social studies, your mathematics, et cetera.
Speaker 2:I really wanted to do something in the shops and so I was really fortunate where our local high school, that's the Foothills Composite High School in Okotoks, they have an incredible, incredible trades program, so they have an entire wing of that building that was devoted to hands-on learning. And so, just going off of memory, the first shop on the left was actually an art studio and they did a lot of really neat art abstracts, paintings, sculptures, all sorts of cool stuff. That wasn't really what drew me in, but I know that they were very busy. The next shop was a woodworking shop and it was very impressive, very well organized, very large, and they, they, they, they produced a ton of graduates that went into the trades out of there. And then the last two were the ones that I engaged in a little bit more, and the second to last was the welding, and I'll talk about that a little bit more in a minute. And then the last one is mechanics, and so I filled my schedule as best I could with that hallway, if you will, and I.
Speaker 2:I took the woodworking I took the welding and I took the mechanics and, um, when I, when I, when I took the welding, there was something that that really spoke to me, um, I thought it was just absolute magic and maybe it still is today uh, that you could, you could pick up a, you know a, a welding gun or a stinger and you can weld, weld upside down, up down, sideways, and all these processes, just, you know, modified, joined, cut metal, like it was nothing. I just I thought that was the coolest thing ever. So I really gravitated towards the welding and I got to give credit there, where there was a really eager instructor. He was, I think, pretty new to the role at the time. His name was Virgil Green and he had come from industry, happened to have a bachelor's degree. So they brought him into the teaching role and they gave him the welding shop.
Speaker 2:And I'll never forget the first day I saw welding. It was Virgil Green leaning over an old beat up table with a stray arcs all over it, uh, and he showed us, uh, how to weld with some 60, 10, and that smell and that, that vision of him welding for the first time, um, I hope that that'll be with me for for all my days. Uh, it was super cool.
Speaker 1:Well, it's so interesting how you bring up, you know, the the initial experience with welding. I mean it sounds like you really had a good opportunity. This shop sounds fantastic. Like I got to visit this place. Like you know, I'm going to have to stop in there. It sounds like a magnificent school.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is it, uh, it's produced, uh, at when, when I went back there a couple of years ago, right before the pandemic, they, they, they try to get a copy of all the journeyman certificate that basically came from that location and they had, I think, two walls in an office covered in um in journeyman certifications wow, for welding, and I thought that was that was just phenomenal, right.
Speaker 2:so to see the people go out there and then the people come back and help the students practice for skills. Uh, it was. It was super cool, so yeah, so fortunate just to be in the right place. You know, could have easily gone easily gone to the Catholic high school across town where great football program but no trades right, no trades yeah, and so I feel very, very fortunate.
Speaker 2:For that, a lot of gratitude. But yeah, virgil really excited me and got me into welding. So my kind of personality is when I get into something, I want to do it 110%. I decided that was the thing at the time. I get into something, I want to do it 110%. I decided that was the thing at the time. And yeah, I practiced a lot and so I ended up kind of stacking up the courses and doing some of the more senior courses in the junior year and ultimately I got tapped on the shoulder and asked if I go to skills. So the regional skills competition participated in skills as a grade 11, as a grade 12. And really I think the thing that was cool there not only did you get to represent the school and have some pride in your craft as a grade 11 student, but that's where I first went to SAIT, where I work today, and I still remember that feeling as well. It's funny how you remember odd things.
Speaker 2:I remember the smell of the Thomas Riley wing in the green floor and and it's just the full sensory experience of going to the big college and that's really where all the experts lived, and that was just such a cool feeling to go there. And so, uh, yeah, I, I was, I, I, I competed in skills, I think four or five times, and um ended up, uh, going to SAIT for my apprenticeship after, after the high school, welding.
Speaker 1:So yeah, that was that started me off on the welding path. How did you do in skills you know like, well, what's the highest you placed?
Speaker 2:Uh, I, I did win gold in high school as a grade 11. And then again as a grade 12,. Uh, when I competed at the post-secondary level, I wasn't quite successful. I think I was on the podium each time. I might've got fourth once, but I never got first. In the post-secondary, I was always second or third. So you know. Something else I think is important is to recognize your skills and the limits of your skills and to be humble.
Speaker 2:And you know you always jokingly can tell people you're the second best welder, but you'll never be the best welder.
Speaker 3:There's always someone out there that has better hand skills, uh, and that's a lesson.
Speaker 2:You know I've taken away from that for sure.
Speaker 1:You weren't looking to like. Pull a Tanya Harding on the first place, uh person, and be like I'll see you outside with this iron bar.
Speaker 2:No, Uh, and you know funny story about the competitors, right? Um, I'll, uh, I'll throw another name out there. So, a good friend of mine at this day, uh, Mr John Belay. Uh, so John and I, um, we grew up together. We knew each other in junior high. We both ended up in the welding program in high school and we kind of progressed together and, uh, it was hilarious because I'm Josh Brewster and he's John Belay and we have the same initials. So it was really hard to tell the skills projects apart. We were neck and neck the whole time and we had the same initials. So I think we started using middle names to identify whose projects were whose. But no, I, I went to school with such an awesome group of people and I learned so much from the other competitors, from my high school instructor, of course, and just being at those competitions was was just eyeopening for all of the trades.
Speaker 2:Uh, in general, right like there's so many there. When you go to those uh expo centers in edmonton and so on, you just had no idea when you're high school it really opens your, your eyes.
Speaker 1:So that's such an awesome, awesome program there so at this point you're coming out of high school, you've already kind of thrown the the bricks into the wheelbarrow for welding. Family's all good with this. Family's like yeah, go for it, son. You know, like welding's your niche, or or or? Was there any deterrence? Was there any like, oh, like I'm trying to place the time how long ago with this, because alberta's very boom and bust, right. So there's always like the trades are awesome and then it's like the trades are not awesome yeah, you know where were you in that cycle?
Speaker 2:uh geez, this would have. This would have been like 2007-ish, I think.
Speaker 1:So we were right before the big drop, price of oil was pretty high. At that time, things were booming.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and yeah, my parents were super supportive of it. I think that they were just more happy that I found a purpose and I was doing you know, being very productive and useful, and not, you know, on a different path. So I think that they were proud, and they had no idea that skills existed either. And so all of a sudden it's like hey, you're, you're winning competitions. We didn't even know these existed and um, I think they were really proud.
Speaker 2:And all all I else remember the. I think I was in grade 11 and my dad bought me my first auto darkening welding helmet for Christmas and um it was an I think it was an op trial and, uh, I I'll never forget the color of that helmet and getting that as well. So, yeah, just these people in your life have such an impact and so much gratitude for those individuals, right.
Speaker 1:So now you're out of high school, Was it? I'm going straight to SAIT to get into the first welding program I can get into. What was the plan?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so funny story. So I got a letter in the mail from Nate, which is our Northern counterpart up in Edmonton and nothing gets Nate. I've been there a lot of times. Awesome programs.
Speaker 2:And so I must've got my name from skills or something, and they basically sent me a letter saying, hey, if you come to Nate, you know it's I can't remember it was it was either free or they pay for part of the tuition, or something like that. Uh, and it was like, yeah, no way, uh, I re, I've been to SAIT. Way, uh, I, I've been to state, I've met the instructors. They know my name. I'm definitely going to say, and of course it's half an hour from where I live, not three and a half hours. But uh, yeah, I went to state and uh, yeah, really enjoyed the apprenticeship. Um, learned as much as I could, phenomenal staff there, right like the labs were awesome, but it's always about the people and and the their stories and their experiences.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, so much gratitude for the, the welding staff.
Speaker 1:They were phenomenal and, uh, I think that I think that they still do a just an excellent job to this day, and I'm thankful for all the people that put up with all of my questions, because I asked a lot of questions well, it's something that I think that western canada has really, you know, done a good job of investing into for a long time and you know, you, you know done a good job of investing into for a long time and you know, you, you, you know as well as I do that we've traveled across Canada.
Speaker 1:We've seen lots of welding programs, lots of colleges and their welding programs and in the back of our minds, you know the SAS, Paulies, the Nates, the States. We know that ours are big. We got, like you know, we go see somebody's star program and they got 40 booths, and like 40, we got 80. What are you talking about? Like you're just a baby program but SAIT's a big deal. Like they got a lot of investment and a lot of, a lot of programming that runs out of that college for the steel trades.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, we've been fortunate. I mean, we've had some incredible donors and our relationship with the government has been great for decades.
Speaker 2:I mean, the organization is over 100 years old. So you know, I think there's a lot of people that went to SAIT, were super successful in their careers and in business and then ultimately come back to support the organization and scale those opportunities for others. And you know, I got a sense of what that feels like at some level and we're so thankful for those individuals. Right, that's the goal is to ready people for not only for a job but for a career in life and to see that success and then it ultimately come back to benefit other people, other students.
Speaker 2:Um, it's really neat to see and I do see that a lot of my current role. It's awesome.
Speaker 1:Well, it's, it's. I love that you bring that up, cause I think that's something in the university academic experience that sometimes gets dropped in the vocational experience. And what I mean is in university you go through a program, you become an alumni. That alumni matters because you want to support your alumni even when you're long out of university and then as you progress you kind of always pitch back to your alumni, like you even see with athletes like I went to college at this college for football to support the college, and then you hope down the track they come back as instructors with all this great experience of what they did in the world as professionals. The trades don't seem to have that connection as well, or some colleges don't seem to have that connection as well and you don't see that long-term I guess you know investment back into where you studied. Do you feel like SAIT does a pretty good job of keeping people kind of on the line?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think we do and I think that any organization is capable of it. I have to tip my hat to our alumni and development folks. They have created an excellent community there with a huge footprint. I believe we're I know we're over a quarter million, I think we're around 300,000 alumni in the organization and they're always nurturing and fostering those relationships.
Speaker 2:And you know, I think it's important to whether it's a post-secondary or any other sort of nonprofit. You have to have a vision and you have to. You know, when someone comes to you or you go to somebody and they're interested in supporting the organization or what you're doing, you have to have a vision and if you don't, it makes it really difficult for them to align themselves with that and support you. So we do a really good job of working with our partners in alumni and development in the organization and I think that some of the success we've seen is not only a testament to you know the careers that we've produced from our grads and our instructors, but it's also all that hard work of building and maintaining those relationships for decades.
Speaker 2:So yeah, it takes a lot of people to move those initiatives along and they're super exciting and absolutely worth it and they benefit the students. You know, in the end they benefit the students by the thousands and that's such a great feeling.
Speaker 1:Yeah, let's go back to you now, back at SAIT. So for the listeners that are in Canada, we're all going to know that Alberta has a compulsory apprenticeship program for welding, which means that you've got to go to school, you've got to be an apprentice and you've got to run through the levels. For the people that are in the US and don't really understand our apprenticeship program, it's a very standardized format of education. I say that a little bit tongue in cheek, because across the provinces it's not all the same, but pretty close. Harmonization is an interesting word sometimes, but Alberta has been consistently a leader in compulsory trades in Canada. So for yourself, you sign up at SAIT, you go, take your first block and what are you thinking? Are you thinking, yeah, this is the right move, I'm going to get out there and start working kicking some butt. How was the experience for you running through your levels at the college and the work life?
Speaker 2:Well, maybe I'll back up just a touch.
Speaker 1:Matt.
Speaker 2:So I actually participated in the RAP program as well in high school. So, again, having that high school with the opportunities. I started my apprenticeship when I was maybe 16. I can't remember, but a minor for sure.
Speaker 2:And so I ended up working over the summer between grade 11 and grade 12. And then actually had enough credits from all the extra work I'd done in the welding shop to just come back for one semester in grade 12 and basically just do all my academics and then be out the door. So I started working as a welding apprentice when I was yeah, 16. And I worked for a small organization that did work on a lot of heavy equipment. That's where I started. I remember the first day, art yard gouging in the hot sun. I thought, geez, this is going to be a long career.
Speaker 1:That actually sounds fun to me now, but in all seriousness my first day on the job site was interesting.
Speaker 2:We shared a yard with a small drilling company and they had some contract welders on doing some work on one of the drilling units and I didn't dare talk to anybody, I was just trying to keep my head down keep the broom going and the arc air gouging happening, making lots of noise. But they had about a 60 foot portable drill rig up across the yard. My first day on the job as a welder apprentice, like you know day one and the welder ended ended up.
Speaker 2:I don't know if he cut or if there was some sort of issue with one of the hydraulic lines, but they had a hydraulic line go on this drill rig and, uh, basically the load that was on the hydraulic line sprayed out a ton of the hydraulic fluid while the guy was down in the bottom of the uh the mast doing some work and he was burned very, very seriously Like, oh, h&s shut us down. I. I didn't follow up to find out what exactly happened and and and if that individual still even able to work as a welder, but he was seriously injured. Uh, you know, in the trade on my very first day.
Speaker 2:And so um, I can remember my boss coming out and talking to me and telling me that you know, they're kind of shutting the whole yard, the whole site down for an investigation and that somebody was really badly burned. And so, um, you know, everybody's a bit of a cowboy when they're 16 and they think they're invincible, and I think that was a really huge wake up call for me day one.
Speaker 2:And so, um, you know my heart's out for that individual, and obviously we never wish that upon anybody, but for me, I learned a lot from that.
Speaker 2:I learned that it was there was a lot of real hazards out there and you needed to be careful and take care of yourself and, you know, do those safety assessments, wear that PPE and think about the ways you can be injured. So the safety element of it for me has been top of mind from literally day one because of that incident. So, yeah, that was eye-opening for me and by the time I went to SAIT after high school I already had maybe a third or even half of my apprenticeship hours.
Speaker 1:So I was a pretty experienced first year apprentice.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and it's very interesting because as an educator it's hard to hammer in safety without an accident. It's a terrible thing to say. I remember early on in my career I wrote an article that got published back then in the welding journal and it was you know. The title was all rules are written in blood, you know. And that's a terrible thing to learn Because you wish you could just explain danger and have people be afraid of it. But until you see it or have experience firsthand with it, that's when it really sinks in, like like these trades have gotten so much safer.
Speaker 2:But it's on you, like you have to be checking those check boxes or else things go sideways real fast yeah, absolutely it's uh yeah, it's critical right, we want everybody to come home at the end of the day, and we can try to instill that as much as we possibly can during, you know, the education process, but at the end of the day, everybody has a part to play in it and everybody has a responsibility to support it. So, yeah, I mean, it takes a community and unfortunately accidents do happen, but the best thing that we can do is learn from them, right? So, yeah, I was fortunate to learn from that one and, yeah, it shaped who I am as a, as a trades person and really for the rest of my life, right, like it's important to recognize that can happen to anybody.
Speaker 1:So so so let me get this straight you're coming into into safe and you already have done your hours. You already are pro safety. You're already been welding for like two years. You're like the keenest, keener kid in level one ever. You know, how did the instructors like you? How was your journey? How are the other students? Cause you'd already been at skills, you had all this experience where you seen as kind of a leader within the class, right off the top, or were you kind of seen as the? You know, this is the teacher's pet.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know, that's a question I think only they could answer. But yeah, what I will say is that I tried to. I asked a lot of questions but I didn't want to be, you know, that person that's slowing class down. I was always eager to learn more.
Speaker 2:I wanted to know outside of the module and, yeah, I always jokingly say I was the welder who asked too many questions, but I tried to be really humble. I'm definitely not the best welder. Never was, never will be. There's always. You know, dozens and dozens of individuals on any given job site that have better hand skills than you.
Speaker 2:But, from from the technical side. I found that quite intriguing. So you know again, phenomenal instructors. I met some of them at skills and they all. I think they had high expectations, but they they treated me the same as everybody else. And I really appreciated that, and that's what I would hope and expect for. So yeah, I try to be humble and I try to learn as much as I can. So it was really the metallurgy that I thought was really interesting.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2:By the time I got to third year, I was sitting in our trade science class, right. So it was a small module of learning about heat treatment and the fundamentals of material science, if you will, for a welder's perspective, and I was like this is so cool, like this is how the metal's actually reacting under all these changing circumstances.
Speaker 2:You hear a lot of, I guess, like hearsay or rules of thumb when you're an apprentice, but to have a meddler just in front of you actually explaining like no, that only is applicable here and and this is what's actually happening. I thought that was really cool, and so one of our current faculty members, mr Brian Brown he tapped me on the shoulder and he's like you ask a lot of questions about the trade science stuff. You should check out our welding engineering technology program and I'm like the heck is that?
Speaker 2:He said it's called WET. I said, okay, what does that mean? He's like there's more to learn in welding. We have a welding engineering-ish program, a welding engineering technology program. I'm like, tell me more. And so I ended up, finishing my apprenticeship, I went to work for a while, I obtained my inspection certification and then I decided to come back for the welding engineering technology program. So I came back to state for a second time and did our two-year diploma there. Yeah, yeah, that was uh, I could fiddle my boots with all of the material science and welding codes and standards that, uh, a real welding geek would, would want.
Speaker 1:And so I was absolutely in my uh, you know, just just right in my, my, my perfect place did you like you said you know you got the time in, you went and did some work, got your inspection. Do you do you wish you would have stayed maybe on the on the on the stinger a little longer? Did you ever have thoughts of maybe like cause you got into academic real quick, like I remember meeting you and you were like 27 or 28 and you were already like climbing, climbing ranks, right, and uh, and I was thinking like, and I think there's lots with young kids that are coming up and it's like you know, take your time and enjoy each step, because sometimes you want to climb so fast that you forget to, you know, just sit in one spot and soak it all in before you go to the next one. Do you feel like you had spent enough time at each kind of post before you moved on to the next one?
Speaker 2:Well, that's a good question and I think it's a fair question and I think to answer that you have to think about what you're trying to get right. And so for me.
Speaker 2:I want to learn and contribute every single day, and so when you start to see the learning fizzle out a little bit and you feel like you're, you know there's always more to learn but you're not getting. You know handfuls of it all the time. For me, um, that that's a good sign that if something comes up and it seems to make sense, I will pivot. And so those opportunities did present themselves to me, um, and I also think it's again really important to be humble. I'll never forget. I came back and I worked at the welding shop. I did my apprenticeship at uh between first and second year of the welding engineering technology program and they're like oh, here's the fancy inspector and welding engineer guy and you know they were really good, but of course there's a little bit of uh.
Speaker 2:It was razzing, yeah, yeah and my very first weld. They're all watching and say, oh well, we'll see what you're capable of. Today I went to strike an arc and I didn't have my lead on.
Speaker 2:So you know and uh we all had a really thorough laugh about that, so I you know, I think you have to be humble, right, um and so, to answer your question, like you know, did I, did I stay in the trades long enough? It's a good question. I could have gone a completely different path. I was really close to starting my heavy duty apprenticeship. Uh, as well, I shop and seeing some, some heavy duty mechanics and I thought that was really neat. That's cool. Yeah, I wanted to learn more there, but at the end of the day, I think that when an opportunity presents itself, you've got to follow your gut, you've got to weigh your options and if something comes up and you think it's the right move, you go for it.
Speaker 2:So I'm grateful for all the time I spent my journeymen and all the other guys in the shop. I learned so much from them, and my first leaders too right, my first shop foreman as a leader. Now I often think of some of the things that my shop foreman said back when I was an apprentice and didn't make any sense, didn't really mean anything and it's funny, some of those lessons take decades to click.
Speaker 2:But you understand some of the techniques they were using and some of the strategies that they were using to engage the people and get things done as a team Right.
Speaker 3:So I've done a lot of reflecting on that as well.
Speaker 2:So, you know, I could have stayed in the trades, I could have done another one, but that opportunity to go back to school came up and, yeah, I went for it, for sure.
Speaker 1:It's funny Cause I think about that with my career all the time because I did the opposite. I stayed in the trades a long time and kind of resisted moving into the next part of my field, because I went down the welding path and then I went down the fabrication path. So that's a bit of a pivot, but not much. And I really resisted. But I didn't start teaching until I was 37. And it was almost late. I was like maybe I spent too much time on the tools.
Speaker 1:But then when I reflect now as a older person in the leadership position, I have so much experience to draw from from those years in the shops that are so applicable Leadership positions. People are like how do you manage so much? You know paperwork? How do you manage so many projects? It's like, well, I used to manage 40 guys on the floor work. How do you manage so many projects? It's like, well, I used to manage 40 guys on the floor. You know, you learn a lot of stuff managing materials and people and times and and all this stuff. And you learn lean and Kaizen and all that stuff. All of that stuff slides right into the office world. It's really not much different, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah I. I always enjoyed kind of the lateral thinking aspect and I think it's really cool when you're on your drive home or your drive to work, or you're sitting there one day and you know you make this connection between something that seems completely irrelevant or happened to you and really a different life or a different career, and you're like I'm noticing that pattern of something that I saw over here, maybe as an issue, or someone approached something in a really different way.
Speaker 2:And it maybe didn't make sense, but you mentally made note of it. And then here you are, you know, five or 10 years later, and you're like, oh, that's what they were doing. Yeah, those are really the same problem, just different circumstances. So I think, being able to tie in those experiences and it's not necessarily how much experience you have, but it's the diversity of the experience that you have what you learned along the way, right?
Speaker 2:I think in any role, right? Whether you're an apprentice, whether you're a high school student, whether you're an instructor, every role has so many things to learn, right?
Speaker 2:And so it's like you need to sit there and you need to get some soak time and if you're really trying to get the most value out of it, you're not counting hours, you're not counting days, you're not counting years or months. You know you can measure that in what you've learned and who you've helped, right. So think about those experiences and what you can learn from not only the people quote unquote above you or in more senior roles, but your peers, right.
Speaker 2:Like every other apprentice, every other instructor, every other manager right, they all have a huge variety of life lessons. Manager, right, they all have a huge variety of life lessons. And even if you can get one or two gems from them, you know a month, you know in an interaction that you have something you can take away.
Speaker 2:I think that that's the really valuable takeaway right. So for me, it's not about as much as the time. I do think there's an amount of soap time that's necessary in every role, but I think it's all about how you can support others and what you can learn from them, and that doesn't. I think it's all about how you can support others and what you can learn from them, and that doesn't. It doesn't matter what role you're in.
Speaker 1:I think that's really key. Yeah, and you know it's like the, the, those, those moments in your career that give you the butterflies. You know that they're not all the time, but I remember as a welder there was those times when you get the butterflies, cause yours is awesome. And then, as a fabricator, you've built your first giant project and that's awesome. Then you become an instructor and you have that first student come in. That is just amazing and you're like, yeah, like you get right behind them. And then, as a manager, you started seeing your employees as the ones that are really pulling out the stops, do a good job, and you get excited for them. You know it's just. You know how you can support the people around you that are kicking a** too right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely Right. You see their success. And even if you were, you know, quietly supporting that in the background, it's just a great feeling, right.
Speaker 2:And that's yeah, I mean, that's the essence of leadership and teamwork. Right Is supporting others so they can do their best work, and if we're all successful, then, yeah, that's the team. The sum is greater than the parts, and so, yeah, I see that at work every day. I'm super lucky to get to work with who I do and, yeah, it's just an amazing experience when you see it work the way that you hope it does, right.
Speaker 1:So, after you got your engineering or your welding engineer technicians, the WET program which is now in many provinces. Alberta was one of the first to have one. Ontario has a few. It's just starting to kind of spread around the country. Where did you go work? What did you do after that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so right out of school I got a job downtown Calgary at an engineering company, and that was in July or August of 2014. And the reason I remember that, max, you alluded to the Boston boom in Alberta and the oil prices tanked in September of 2014. Alluded to the bust and boom in alberta and the oil prices tanked in september of 2014. So, uh, I was. I. I took on this, this role at this engineering company in quality assurance. Um, I didn't know what meeting minutes were.
Speaker 2:Uh, I wasn't that great on computer at all, and so they put me in this back office with this, uh really senior admin person, and she taught me so much.
Speaker 2:You talk about, like you know, luck of the draw and who you get to sit beside and share an office with, oh my gosh, uh, that I learned the ropes of kind of like computers, meetings, corporate atmosphere from her. I was just like a vacuum for information. So I got a shout out to her for, for all, she taught me, um, but I was in that job again, uh, for only only a few months and months. And I got a call from one of the instructors at SAIT. His name was Cody Blackmore and he had taught me in the WET program and he said hey, I'm leaving, I'm going to industry and we're going to be putting a job posting up. You should really think about applying. And I was totally taken aback and I didn't consider that at all.
Speaker 2:I was just ready to go to work in the private industry again and I remember talking to my wife about it and humming and hawing. I said do you see how I'm really young, Like, do I have enough experience? And I was like, well, you know what I'll put my name in and if they think I'm the best candidate and it is what it is.
Speaker 2:I know the people there. I was like you know what, I'll throw my name in that and I ended up being successful and I was a faculty member, uh, in the wet program for uh, I think, seven semesters, and so I got to teach a variety of our courses there. Uh, codes and standards and failure and mitigation are always my favorite and uh yeah, I think I've seen one of your presentations back then on on that.
Speaker 1:That was usually what you presented on Pardon. What was that when you would present that at conferences? I believe one of your presentations that I watched you on was on mitigation of failed wealth failures.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, yeah, and so.
Speaker 1:Sorry, I have a weird memory like that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's probably correct. I you know that was a while back now, but yeah, I did try to get out outside of our classrooms and bring industry to our students and bring what we were doing to industry. So, yeah, I spent a lot of time presenting, attending conferences and seminars and, yeah, publishing some stuff as well. So, yeah, I had a ton of fun. I got to. I got to be the biggest welding geek in the world and they paid me for it, so that was that was unreal.
Speaker 2:I remember bringing Yasmees section nine home to read in the evenings and my wife's like why are you reading a four? Inch thick code book. I was like, oh, this is awesome. I want to know this thing inside and out and know how to navigate it.
Speaker 1:And I just I absolutely loved that time and I look back really fondly on it. I got my library of books behind me. I mean people are like, why do you keep them? And it's like you have no idea how often I go back and just open one and be like, oh yeah, okay, I remember that's pretty cool yeah exactly.
Speaker 2:So yeah, and then I saw a lot of the people I taught in those years. Now they're. You know, a person like Paul Robanski, you know chapter. Chair of the Calgary chapter of the CWBA.
Speaker 1:And, yeah, now you're working with those individuals in industry and seeing them succeed. So it's just, it's just awesome to see that full circle. I, I really enjoyed it.
Speaker 2:So after your seven semesters, uh, teaching in the wet program. Then what happened? Um, an opportunity came up for, uh, a position called academic chair, which is like the department head, and um, yeah, I, I ended up taking on that role, and I did that role from 2018 to about a year and a half ago.
Speaker 1:Yeah, a year and a half ago, and yeah.
Speaker 2:I looked after both. I supported the faculty and supported the program in welding engineering technology, as well as our non-destructive testing portfolio, and so that was. I was familiar with NDT as a welder right.
Speaker 2:And some of those inspection methods and my training in wet, but I had never practiced as an NDT technician and so to take on that portfolio was again a huge learning opportunity. Faculty there learn more about the training and the quality systems and the regulators and yeah, I had a lot of fun with with that team that was. It was such a great opportunity and those folks are phenomenal.
Speaker 1:Well, this is a good time to take a break because we're right up to the transition into your current career. But I just wanted to tell a quick story here for the audience, as I remember, one of the first times I met you we actually like got to hang out and talk and have a good time was out in, uh, in halifax. We were out there for a conference and there was like, um, we had to go across the harbor. There was like an event happening. We had to like get across the harbor to go to. I think the bar was called lower decks, lower deck yeah, do you remember that night?
Speaker 1:yeah yeah, I was in the basement, yeah, and they had a band and stuff and I remember I didn't know you well, but I had seen you here and there and I was presenting. You were presenting at the conference. We both had our talks and we were sitting there having a beer and you're starting to get late and you're still pretty young and I was. I was like, oh, yeah, you know, nice to meet you. You're presenting. Yeah, I teach at state. I was like, yeah, I teach at sask poly. You know like blah, blah, blah and uh, and you're I gotta get, I gotta get back early Cause I gotta start practicing for tomorrow morning. And I was like, ah, come on, you could stay. You're a welder, you, you can stay later. I made you stay a couple drinks more but eventually you left. And the next day I was presenting before you at like nine in the morning and you were like, how did you do that? How did you stay out so late and present? And I was like practice, my friend, practice, practice, practice.
Speaker 2:Well, that's a lesson I guess I still need to learn.
Speaker 1:No, I've learned now, after 20 some years of doing this, there's not a lot of people that can do what I do, yeah.
Speaker 2:Well, max, if I can say one thing about that, um, you know, like, for example, uh, I came out of the the apprenticeship as a Dean's award winner and people go, oh man, it must've, you know, you, you you killed that. It must've been really easy. And I always tell people, I tell the students, you know, you think that I'm not nervous before those exams those tests, the stakes, those welding tests, anything right, inspection, certification exams, all the stuff you go through.
Speaker 2:I get huge test anxiety always have you know. I found good ways to work around it, but for me feeling well prepared really helps with that, and so that's probably what was happening behind the scenes, Max? It was something to help me with my nerves before getting up on that stage the next day.
Speaker 1:Well, and you did a great job. You were very professional. I remember thinking like you and you were not Dean yet or academic chair, and I remember like within a couple of years you got that academic chair and you were you were chair of the of the CWBA in Calgary too at the time. So I was like, okay, I gotta, I gotta keep an eye on this guy. He's, he's moving places here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was uh, yeah, a lot of opportunities, but I just I don't want people to think that people, uh, don't get test anxiety or are nervous. We're all nervous and you gotta be humble and uh, you know, practice, practice, practice Right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely. It was funny, Cause I I, I take medication for anxiety. People are like you're anxious, like man. I've been anxious since I was like three years old. I just express it differently. I just don't shut up, you know. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, everybody is a little bit different, right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, All right. So we're going to take a break right here. With Josh Brewster coming to us from St he's in Calgary, we're going to be right what's going on now and with his current job and some of the really cool things going on in his department, so don't go anywhere. We'll be right back after these words from our sponsors. Looking for top quality welding machines and accessories, Look no further than CannaWeld. Based in Vaughan, Ontario, CannaWeld designs, assembles and tests premium welding machines right here in Canada. Our products are CSA certified and Ontario made approved, reflecting our unwavering commitment to excellence. Count on us for superior service that's faster and more efficient than market competitors. Whether you're in aerospace, education or any other precision welding industry, CannaWeld has the perfect welding solution for you. Visit CannaWeldcom today to discover why professionals rely on CannaWeld for their welding needs. Cannaweld where precision meets reliability in welding. Enjoy peace of mind with our 4-year warranty on most machines. Conditions do apply.
Speaker 1:Josephgassesca, your one-stop welder's superstore. Whether you run a welding shop or are just starting your welding journey, Joseph Gass, the welder's superstore, is the best place for everything related to welding. Come to the site or browse our top picks of welders, helmets and welding supplies specific to your industry, Even filter out the items eligible for manufacturer cash rebates. Our intuitive search tool puts everything at your fingertips and checkout is always a breeze. Pay securely with your credit card at any time. If you are ready to streamline your welding supply shopping experience, visit josephgassesca that's Joseph with an F as in family. Start filling your cart with welder confidence. Hello, and we are back here at the CWB Association podcast. My name is Max Ceron, your host for the day, and I'm here with Josh Brewster, who's coming to us from Calgary. It is a beautiful home and a current academic no associate dean for the Aviation and Technology Center in let's say I think I got that right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you did, it's a mouthful Good job it is.
Speaker 1:It is center in at state. I think I got that right. Yeah, you did. It's a mouthful good job it is, it is. But like I mean, so people are listening to that title and they're like, wait a second. I thought you said this guy was a welder, right, and uh and and like a welder, that the best type of welder in a suit is the one with the street cred. Right, because those are, you have the easiest way to converse. That language barrier is kind of something that is an issue sometimes between academia and the blue collar People like yourselves. You can speak on both sides of that fence very easily, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, you try to, and I really think that's the job of an engineering technologist, right. You have people that are really analytical and really technical, and then you have those that are actually, you know, creating things with their hands, right? Whether?
Speaker 2:they're fixing things, you're building things, et cetera, and so to be able to bridge that gap is the engineering technologist and that was one of the other things I really enjoyed about the welding engineering technology program is I learned to speak engineer and I already knew how to speak welder and I was able to bring those things together and make a, you know, a work environment where we could all move things forward and and that was really critical. So, yeah, it's being able to bridge that gap, I think.
Speaker 1:It's interesting you said that last year at a conference I had an engineer say that one of the problems they thought is with the language barrier is that engineers always felt like they have to dumb their talk down to welders, and I took offense to that. I took offense to that because I thought that statement in itself really expresses some of the bias that exists, because you and I know that there's welders out there that maybe don't even have a grade 10, but they're doing magic. They're doing magic Right, and uh and I don't like the term of dumbing down or or talking up, I feel like it's the same language, just sometimes you just don't know the vernacular for the thing you're doing and and also how to express it Right, like. What are your thoughts on that, since you're kind of on both sides of that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I have a presentation slide when I was volunteering for the international pressure equipment folks years ago and we talked about individual circle of competency so where are you competent and where does your competency end? And I think knowing where your competency is and where it ends is really important and recognizing that everybody has a circle of competency and they're different and they overlap in some cases and there's gaps in other cases. And so I think it's really critical for anybody whether you're a welder or an engineer or a business person um, to understand and really look yourself in the mirror and say you know, where where do I, where do I know that I have some gaps? And who can?
Speaker 2:help me fill those. So I think being humble and recognizing where your circle of competency ends is the first step for anybody, and not thinking you know everything, or you're a mile wide and a mile deep. That's how you get yourself into trouble, quite frankly, right, yeah, absolutely, and it'll rub people the wrong way. The other thing is, I always talked about science, right, and so, really, when you think of engineering, you think of scientists and you think of trades or technologists, or.
Speaker 2:NDT, technicians. Those are all types of science. It's applied science, and so I always think of it as a spectrum of applied science, not a hierarchy. And so on one end, you have your PhD researching scientist that is exploring new things, and on the other side, you have the masters of application. Right, those are the trades and technicians. They deal with the real world problems and they make things happen. They turn a blueprint and raw materials into something, and I think that there's significant value in both of those things, but they're obviously much different. And then, of course, you have engineers and technologists kind of along the middle Around the middle yeah.
Speaker 2:I think when we can understand where our perspectives come from, understand our circles of competency and then overlap those so we're speaking the same language, that's really where we can make that magic happen. And of course, you need to wrap all of that in respect right. You need to respect and be willing to learn and understand where people are coming from, right. They probably know a lot of things that you don't, and the other way around.
Speaker 2:And if you can learn from each other, then you're going to make the best product possible, be the most efficient possible and really get to work together and learn to enjoy each other's company too right as a byproduct. So that's the way I look at it. I look at it as a spectrum of applied science and I have a huge amount of respect from an apprentice to a PhD scientist. I think we all have our place.
Speaker 2:We wouldn't have the science and the technology we have, if we didn't have the researchers and if we didn't have the people applying this and doing a great job with their hand skills on a day-to-day basis, working art, we wouldn't have any products either. So we're all necessary in that ecosystem and I think it's really important to recognize that.
Speaker 1:I love the circle of competency. You know I've taken some courses and I've seen like similar. You know ways to lay that out, but you laid it out so well there in terms of you know that it's a constant internal dialogue that you have as a professional of what did I learn? How can I use it, how is it applicable? What don't I know? And then again you start again what can I learn? How can I use it, how is it applicable?
Speaker 1:And then you just roll through that because A, if you learn something and don't use it, you didn't really learn it, you just heard it. That's not the same thing as learning. And then once you learn it, you got to apply it or else it didn't Then who cares? If you learned it and you didn't apply, it also falls under the who cares banner. And then if, once you apply it, you're going to find out that there was something that's not right that always happens or some gap, and then you start that cycle again and you need all hands on deck, all layers, to work yourself through that, through that cycle Right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've seen it in practice, uh, on the shop floor. Uh, I've seen it interacting between the trades and engineering folks and I just yeah, I think it's critical, absolutely, it's so important and you know you can take that outside of the trades as well, and you can think of senior leaders in an organization and your administrative staff on, you know, answering phones and sending emails. Same thing applies there, right?
Speaker 1:So again, you can take those lessons that you see in the trades and you can apply them to the business world as well. Absolutely, and everyone is just as important as everyone else in that cycle. There's no top or bottom, it's just the job.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely, I mean everybody is an individual, everybody has hopes and dreams and everybody can contribute in their own unique way, and so the sooner you recognize that and try to get that kind of foster that in people you know, the more successful you were moving on.
Speaker 1:You were moving on on, which may be sad because you had done a great job as as the chair in Calgary, paul's doing a great job still like in their very strong chapter. But then I seen where you were going for your role and I was like where the heck is this guy going? Now you know you're, you're talking and I went and saw your center. I went for the tour, I went for the chapter event. It was amazing. I had no idea that was in Calgary. So tell us about the role you got, what you do and kind of what they do there.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So when the associate dean position came up, it included both our engineering technology programs and aviation. And so, yeah, I quite frankly had the same thought as you, max. It was like, oh, aviation, it's like I like to fly places. Aren't those just rivets, exactly Right, and so, yeah, let's talk about that aviation a little bit. So, first of all, all of the shop floors are painted white and you could eat off of them.
Speaker 2:So coming from a fabrication shop and welding it's like this feels really, really foreign to me. So what does the first couple months or a few days look like in a role like that, right? And so, first of all, I mentioned being humble and I mentioned getting to know people, right? So, first and foremost, I might feel awkward because I'm not from an aviation background and most of those staff out there we have close to 50 staff at that location they probably don't know me either and are wondering what I'm all about, and so the very first thing I did was get to know everybody spend time on the hangar floor, as we call it and
Speaker 2:get to get to know people, learn their names, understand what they do you know, learn a little bit about their, their interests and their family and really get to you know, be part of that, that community. And so our, our location. People typically think of SAIT's main campus, which is phenomenal and always under construction because we're always growing and improving, and it's in the center of Calgary, but we actually have a few what we call satellite campuses as well and other locations.
Speaker 2:So we have some locations downtown for our advanced technology. We have our culinary students downtown every day. We have a location that does our crane and iron worker. Funny story about that. People used to call SAIT and ask them what building they were putting up. But it was the iron workers putting their project together in the lot. So you know we needed more space.
Speaker 2:We laid some railroad track down at that location and then the Aero Campus, or the Art Smith Aero Center as it's formally called is attached right to the airport, so we have what's called airside access, where we can actually have guests come in right from the main airport at the country.
Speaker 1:I've seen that. I've seen that that would be so tempting, Like all you got to do is open a gate and you can, like, hit a main runway. I was like, oh man, I'd be so tempted to be, like, come out of here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, we had the Canadian. The Royal Canadian Air Force is trying to recruit our students quite often and so twice since I've been in this role now they've come to recruit students and I'm not an expert in student recruiting, but fighter jets seem to help, uh. So they, they roll up with helicopters and an f-18 and, uh, blow all of our hair straight back and, um, yeah, the students really enjoy that, so really eye-opening for them for some of the opportunities. So a lot of people think that we train pilots, but we do not. We train kind of four other areas. So we train aircraft maintenance engineers, which is like your aircraft mechanic. Avionics, which is like airplane electronics, so think of a cockpit and all the buttons and screens and sensors in there.
Speaker 2:And then we have what's called our aircraft structures, and so that's the body or the airframe of the aircraft, the fuselage, the wings, all those structural components you know, you see, a hundred thousand rivets out your window when you're sitting on an airplane, you know who is manufacturing and repairing those, and then we've kind of led the way, at least in Western Canada for sure, in the uh, the drone space.
Speaker 2:Uh and so we have a couple of really interesting programs out there. So, yeah, I've been, uh, getting to know the staff out there. It's a phenomenal culture, very exciting, very busy and, um, yeah, getting getting into all these new spaces and so, um, it's been a great learning opportunity. I'm super grateful for all the staff out there. They do an awesome job and it is so busy. We have essentially doubled the programming in the last couple of years and we're coming up against, you know, limitations in some of our parking and things like that so it's nice to see, and we've just got a phenomenal group of people out there.
Speaker 1:So where are these students going? Because, like we've, we watch the news and we see, like Boeing's pulled out of Canada, you know, like you see, a lot of the other airline manufacturers have pulled out of Canada or reduced their size and you're saying that your students are doubling. So there must be other industries that they service, or outside of the big, the big three or whatever, of aeronautics. So, like, where do they go? What kind of jobs are they picking up?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so for sure. So I think people relate it to what they see, just like you and I do, right. So I made a video earlier about being on an airplane going somewhere. So we have, for example, westjet and Air Canada. We can literally see their hangars and their aircraft and so they are big, big employers. Of course I mentioned the Royal Canadian Air Force so that that that training can move you into getting into the military as well.
Speaker 2:Obviously, their stuff is all painted gray and you know you mount ordinance on it, which is pretty awesome, so that's a great career path. And then there's a lot of small outfits as well, and I mean let's talk helicopters, right. We're close to the mountains in Calgary. You think fires, you think rescue, you know oil and gas access, all those types of things. Luxury trips A ton of of small companies as well Charter jets right Um. All of that is local, so there's there's a ton of work in that area.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like I know, in Saskatchewan bush planes are very common. Like many, many farmers, especially when you go up north, there's only remote access many, many helicopters, many, many small planes and I mean small, but not that small, like you know 15, 20 passenger planes and they're moving up and down and flipping around all the time and I guess you don't really stop to think how often those need to be maintenanced, how often they need to have repair.
Speaker 2:And who does that right? Yeah, absolutely Right. They need to kind of repair. And who does that right? Yeah, absolutely right. Like I always thought of aircraft structures and it's like you know, people have hard landings and they can damage aircraft on landings and it's like, okay, well, who fixes that right? You don't just throw the airplane away. Most of the time you have trained experts, follow a process and repair them right. So, yeah, that happens all behind the scenes and I don't think it's something we often think about, but it's. Yeah, it's extremely busy and very interesting.
Speaker 1:So in your year and a half there you said you've seen a lot of growth. What's driving the growth here? Are you guys just recruiting so much better, or do you see industry kind of pushing people into like saying, hey, there's a lot of job openings here?
Speaker 2:Yeah, all the above. So both on the demand and the supply side, it's extremely busy. We have a ton of interest from the public. People really see these careers as great opportunities and so we have a ton of interest. We will put on an info session and it'll be overflowing. On the demand side, from industry, uh, there was a lot of pent up travel demand from the pandemic right, people didn't take vacations, uh, you know, in the early 2020s, and we've seen that bounce back. And then, generally in aviation, all of the forecasts that I look at, uh, both here in Alberta, so it's top of mind for for, uh, the province and Calgary economic development, it's aviation is on their list.
Speaker 2:Um but globally, aviation is picking up and I think really what's driving that at a global level is, you know, you think of Southeast Asia, you think of countries that wouldn't have had people that were flying very often, and they're starting to get that larger middle class and those individuals with the funds to actually start to travel and pay for that airfare. And so we have, you know, hundreds of millions, if not a billion perhaps, people getting themselves to a point in these, these, these various countries where they're going to start flying, and so we're seeing massive growth areas, both, uh, africa, southeast Asia, et cetera, and so that just puts uh constraints on on all of the aircraft manufacturers and the maintenance programs across the world. So, yeah, a lot of things driving it, but very, very, very exciting.
Speaker 1:Now, what about all the trends for green energy? Where does aviation sit on the green spectrum? Because that's been fundamentally one of the things. You know, we can track Taylor Swift's footprint from her jet. All the vehicles are getting more, you know, green friendly Motorcycles are getting green friendly Scooters, you know segways. We've got all these forms of transportation. What about planes? What's happening there in that space to say, hey, we're trying to?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I'll start by saying that I'm not an aeronautical engineer, but the trends that I have noticed are a couple of things, and so we can actually try that back a little bit to the welding and the material side. So when you look at a lot of new aircraft, they are not made of aluminum, they're made of composite materials, right, and so lighter means more fuel efficient period. And so you're seeing a lot of the more modern aircraft made by advanced materials.
Speaker 2:So the fuselage itself, again advanced materials and so they've been able to cut the fuel efficiency quite a bit, uh, by using advanced materials and lightening up the aircraft, making them more efficient, and there's a lot of engine technology as well. Yeah, I don't think we'll see electric or anything like that on an aircraft again too heavy.
Speaker 1:The batteries are just too heavy yeah.
Speaker 2:Again, I'm not an expert, but that's what I see. But what we're seeing is, just like the internal combustion engine on your car, we're seeing a lot of advances in efforts to make things more fuel efficient. So, again, some of the fan blades and things like that are being made of more advanced materials and there's so much engineering and design that goes into them it absolutely will make your head spin. I've I had the opportunity to uh tour some uh, I guess, jet engine or gas turbine factories and it's, it's just phenomenal.
Speaker 2:You know a totally different world than what I was used to on the welding side, but what they're doing is they're making the engines more efficient. So you look at some of these more modern aircraft uh, the leap 1b, 1a, 1b engines and they're doing is they're making the engines more efficient. So you look at some of these more modern aircraft, the Leap 1A, 1b engines and they're advertising things like 20, or I believe even 30% more fuel efficient than the previous generation. So you know, is their fuel consumed Absolutely? But are they becoming significantly more efficient? Yeah, absolutely. And again, changing requirements for aircraft maintenance engineers, avionics, you know. Think of all the sensors on your modern vehicle, same thing on the aircraft. So the technology is changing too, and for the better. It's quite interesting.
Speaker 1:Well, I know that when I was at the aero center there doing the tour I got to start a helicopter engine. I got to no it was an aero, the engine that they have there. It wasn't a helicopter, it might have been.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we have like a dyno bay right. Yeah, yeah, where you put a vehicle engine and you fire it up and run it through its paces. The students build an engine, disassemble it and then they run it through its paces. So yeah, we have a little test cell there behind bulletproof glass. You can, so I I got to start that motor.
Speaker 1:It was super fun. I you know the procedures that are in there and I remember them discussing about how many redundant systems planes have to have Because you can't have a stall in midair. It's like you can't blow it. You can blow a tire on a car and you have a spare tire in the back. That's okay, things are going to happen, but on a plane you can't blow a wing and have a wing in the back to change it out while you're in midair. There are so many interesting redundant systems for safety and I was like you know that's amazing that you have to think nine steps ahead on any valve Like oh, this valve will do X. Well, what if valve can't do X? Then what does X? Oh, this other valve. What if that valve can't do X? Well then we got this other valve. It that valve can't do x? Well then we got this other valve.
Speaker 2:It's like okay, wow, yeah, one of the cool things was it's like okay, before we go to whole power, we test our first set of spark plugs, right and then we test the other set just to make sure they're both working right. And coming from the automotive side, you're like you have two sets right and yeah, there's a redundancy for everything, right?
Speaker 1:so, yes, they do have spark plugs yes, they do yes so now you know, in your role as a leader coming from industry from the ground up, you know when you're looking to lead now, your, your, your department, your team, you know what are some of the, the visions or the guiding principles that you're looking to put into them or instill into your staff and to your department to say, you know, let's, let's really keep the focus on these, say two to three things to make sure that we're, you know, satisfying industry, satisfying the students and uh, and keeping up with the Joneses, cause at the end of the day, colleges have to keep up with the Joneses.
Speaker 2:So yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2:And you know, academia sounds quite boring at the surface, but there's a lot happening behind the scenes and really that's my role is to support others and make sure they have the resources they need so we can take that student experience and scale it up right. I value the connection that we are between individuals and their hopes and dreams and industry and their needs, right. So you know, I talked about my first day at SAIT and I remember the green floors and the smell and just really I talk about that because it's those sensory pieces that stick with you but really it was just like, oh my gosh, this is where all the experts live and they know, all the things I need to know to be successful in my career, right, and so, for me personally, I always lean back on that when I'm sitting there looking at a spreadsheet or making some sort of decision.
Speaker 2:And at the end of the day, right, we want to ensure our programs are relevant, they need to be industry driven and I want to bring that experience to as many students as possible. So that's kind of how I frame my role, and it's a little bit more review removed from the classroom.
Speaker 2:So when you're an instructor, max, you've been one you see that light bulb turn on every day, right, I always talk about that. I, as an instructor, said you have like one of those oh aha moments, you know, maybe like once an hour and they go. Yeah, I'm like cool. We delivered 120,000 contact hours last year, so that means we had 120,000 aha moments. You know, that's a good feeling.
Speaker 2:And you know it's a silly metric that I say jokingly, but I really mean it, and so it's bringing that experience to the students at scale. And so for me, it's often, you know, what do people want and what do they need, and we're always trying to balance that. We want student experience. It's all about student first, but then we're also hearing things from industry, and so we're trying to bridge that gap and do it in a way that it's sustainable and we can grow it in the long term and bring it to more people.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, that's my role and so really it's supporting others who support the classroom and trying to bring that student experience at a scale of, yeah, hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands and how's the gig so far?
Speaker 1:how do you like it year and a half in?
Speaker 2:uh, learning is taking place. You know um I uh, it's a lot yeah, I mean. So, like I like between you know, let's go back to first year of welding apprenticeship and then today, right, uh, my philosophy hasn't changed.
Speaker 2:I think that you need to work hard, I think you need to look for opportunities and I think you need to be really grateful and try to learn from the people around you, right? So I always there is the saying that there's no opportunity without responsibility. So you know, in these roles you have more responsibility and you need to recognize that. But at the end of the day, I try to remain personable, I try to remain friendly, I try to remain grounded and I try to, you know, help people as best I can and simultaneously learn from all the experts around me, right.
Speaker 2:You have to be humble. Like. I'm not an aircraft maintenance engineer not even close but I work with 40. So what can I learn from them?
Speaker 1:every day. Right, it's pretty cool. Well, that just ties up into the perfect segue for how I wanted to round out this interview, because we're we, it's, we're doing awesome, but our time's coming to a close. We always have so much fun talking together. Josh um is is about your risk, your, I guess, ability or desire that you've always had, that I've seen in you to work with associations. You work with multiple associations. You volunteer with multiple groups. I've seen you be a part of many committees. I see your name go by Even today at my desk. I'll see some committee go by and be like well, there's Josh's name, he's a part of that thing. And you were, like I said, a chair for the CWB chapter in Calgary. Chair for the CWB chapter in Calgary. How important is that not-for-profit, volunteer side aspect of our industry? You know how important has that been in your life and the changes or things that it's brought to you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's super critical. I volunteered for a lot of different organizations in a lot of capacities over the last 10 years.
Speaker 2:Sometimes it's just coaching high school students back at the front of the composite and sometimes it's leading committees, and at the end of the day, the common thread is giving back and providing opportunities, right.
Speaker 2:So any of those industry groups, including the Canadian Welding Bureau Association or any of these other areas, I see it as an opportunity to improve and to either improve or fix things in industry, right, and so I think a lot of times you find people that you know they're familiar with some sort of issue or long-standing problem and really wish that we could fix that, and I often see my participation in all those as an opportunity to help people.
Speaker 2:Whether we're bringing welding to junior highs that don't have welding programs, whether we're showing welders what their career can look like as a welding inspector, and that it's not out of range, it's in fact right there and super easy to get into. Or, you know, is it fixing a standard that you know perhaps has limited people from getting into a particular field? Right, so sometimes it's more at that national level, but it's fixing some of what I would say are these root causes and some of the systems that are actually acting as bottlenecks? Right, and so we want to uphold standards, but we also want to make things efficient, and so, being on those committees. You get to participate in that and it's very rewarding. And again, it's removed from the day to day perhaps, but you know, sometimes it takes five years, but you go. Yeah, a change finally made it out and people are lining up to do this new thing that didn't exist in 2015.
Speaker 2:And so yeah it takes you longer to see the results, but it's great to work with a lot of people who are passionate about improving, educating, exposing people to these, these areas. So, yeah, I can't say enough, go find a position, whether you're handing out name tags or booking events. Go volunteer and help your local community. It's really rewarding and you can bring these opportunities that you've maybe been privy to to others, and that's super rewarding and ultimately moves the industry and the trade forward.
Speaker 1:So yeah, can't say enough good things about volunteerism.
Speaker 1:And the networking that you create. You know you talked about right from a high school kid. You know the instructors and the mentors, even the friends that you made that are peers that end up being mentors in their own way and supporting you. Those networks that you create throughout this industry are incredible. We say it all the time the world is huge, but the welding world is small. Somehow we all know each other, we all connect, we all network. How important have those networks been in your career and your advancement in your career.
Speaker 2:I think it's one of those things that's hard to measure but very important right. Um yeah, they're, they're, they're super critical. I have interviewed and been interviewed by so many people and you never know what side of the table you're going to sit on. So you know, uh, always be respectful always be, humble and and and make those connections right.
Speaker 2:Everybody has a story. Everybody wants to, you know, tell you about, you know why they're there and what interests them. And, yeah, building those connections. You might not see that person for five or six years, but if you take the time to make a connection with them, they're going to remember you and you're going to remember them five, six years down the road and you never know what that situation is going to look like.
Speaker 2:But making those connections is so important, right? You never know what position you're going to be in. You could be looking for work, you could be on a committee or you could be in some completely seemingly different area, but somehow run into them and it's just always great to have those connections. So, yeah, networking is critical, and when people see you out there working hard and making events happen, reaching out to high schools, taking your evenings to go do stuff, perhaps, or a weekend at a welding rodeo, people notice that and it goes a long long ways.
Speaker 2:You just might not see the results that day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, now, what's coming up, what's in the future for Josh? Like what do you? I feel like you don't have a big plan and I don't know if you've ever really had a plan. You just kind of at the top of the food chain for for where you are. But I don't look at the world that way. I don't really believe in a top of the food chain thing. You know there's always other things, even if they're lateral. What are some of the things you'd like or still on the bucket list for josh?
Speaker 2:yeah, I think that, uh, I think we're working on some really innovative programs. Um, I can't talk about a lot of them because we're just into really preliminary stages, but I think that where I work is phenomenal and we are bringing that student experience at scale and you know we're going to continue to grow what we already do, but we're looking at some programming in some really exciting new areas that I think industry needs and we want to be in and we want to bring that experience to prospective students.
Speaker 2:So for me, I think that that's really exciting and, yeah, I'm working on my master's degree right now MBA and so I really appreciate that because I know what the students feel like. You know, you're like I don't want to read this today, but you got to, so I'm continuing to educate myself in that matter.
Speaker 2:But really, from a work perspective, we've got some phenomenal new programming coming online in the next couple of years in the drone space, in the material space, and I'm really excited about getting those across the finish line with the support of all the subject matter experts. We have, and you know, hoping to see what that next chapter looks like as far as programming and student experience. So, yeah, it's very exciting.
Speaker 1:Awesome. How can people that are listening to the podcast find out more about the programs that are running at SAIT and or within even your department?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so the first place I would lead them to is our website. So, saitca, we have well over 100 programs. The programs that I've been talking about are in our schools of manufacturing and automation, as well as our school of transportation, and so if you go to our website and you look up those particular areas, you'll see our programs listed there. And, yeah, if folks want to reach out, I'm on LinkedIn so I'm happy to carry on conversations or get them connected with the right person from there.
Speaker 1:Awesome man. Well, this is pretty much the end of the interview. This is fantastic. I love it. Always great to see you. When are we going to hang out some more Now that you're not in the welder circle? I don't see you as much anymore.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know Well, we'll sign up for some CWBA events and.
Speaker 2:I'm sure we'll see each other there. We can catch up. I you know I love all that you're doing here. I've been following the podcast for quite some time now. Um, love listening to all the different perspectives. I think you're doing an awesome job. Uh, I think that the, the canadian welding bureau association, is very impressive and, uh, you guys are bringing a lot of opportunities to people at scale across the country and across the world. You mentioned the us. I know we've set up, I believe, in south america as well. So, from that perspective, hats off to all the volunteers and employees, yourself included, and I really appreciate all the work that you do every day. I think we're we're opening up a lot of opportunities, and that's pretty cool feeling.
Speaker 1:Well, it's about giving back a hundred percent. That's my story too. Uh, this fit, this trade has given me nothing except a great life, and I can only expect it to give others the same right. So why not?
Speaker 2:Exactly Well. Thank you, sir, Appreciate the time and thanks for having me on Awesome.
Speaker 1:Thanks a lot and for all the people that have been following the podcast, thank you so much. We are growing, we are expanding, we are moving into the US. So the new we just dropped the new American Welding Program, which is a special program that is sense ready, cwi ready, it is everything ready for the Americans in their specific industry. We are also now looking at Spanish language programming for South America and bringing on new sponsors in the South American regions to connect schools, colleges and industry down there, because the Americas are a very closed loop as far as industry, so we got to maintain that those connections and grow together because really anyone that and industry down there, because the Americas are a very closed loop as far as industry, so we got to maintain that those connections and grow together because really anyone that grows in this industry supports us all. So you know, keep watching and downloading the podcast and I'll catch you at the next episode. Thank you, we hope you enjoy the show.
Speaker 3:You've been listening to the CWB Association Welding Podcast with Max Zerva. If you enjoyed what you heard today, rate our podcast and visit us at cwbassociationorg to learn more. Feel free to contact us if you have any questions or suggestions on what you'd like to learn about in the future. Produced by the cwb group and presented by max, this podcast serves to educate and connect the welding community. Please subscribe and thank you for listening.