The CWB Association Welding Podcast
The CWB Association Welding Podcast
Episode 210 with Paisley Witkowski and Max Ceron
The CWB Association brings you a weekly podcast that connects welding professionals around the world and unrepresented communities as we continue to strive for a more diverse workforce. Join us as we celebrate Women Empowerment Month to learn about the incredible contributions of Women in the welding industry and our communities.
Dive into today's episode featuring Paisley Witkowski, a Welding and Metallurgical Engineer from Houston, TX. Her journey from a quaint farming community in Ontario to the bustling world of the oil sands in Fort McMurray leads to her being a trailblazer in welding engineering. As the Vice President of Technical Services for the International Welding Bureau, she shares her unique insights on the engineering field, reflecting on personal stories of challenges and triumphs. Paisley encourages female engineers to embrace vulnerability, emphasizing that expressing one's emotions is not a weakness but a strength!
Follow Paisley:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/misspaisleycameron/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/international.welding.bureau?igsh=MTN6cXE4bmF4dzMzeA==
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All right, I can check. Check, I'm good. So I'm Max Duran. Max Duran, cwb Association Welding Podcast. Pod pod podcast. Today we have a really cool guest welding podcast. The show is about to begin.
Speaker 1:Attention welders in Canada looking for top quality welding supplies, look no further than canada welding supply. With a vast selection of premium equipment, safety gear and consumables. Cws has got you covered. They offer fast and reliable shipping across the country. And here's the best part all podcast listeners listeners get 10% off any pair of welding gloves. Can you believe that? Use code CWB10 at checkout when placing your next order, visit CanadaWeldingSupplyca now. Canada Welding Supply, your trusted welding supplier. Happy welding. Hello and welcome to another edition of the CWB Association podcast. My name is Max Ceron and, as always, I'm looking for the stories out there that are fantastic for us to bring to you, our faithful listeners. Today I have a wonderful lady here who I met at Fabtech this year for the first time and was really starstruck by the amount of personality, intelligence and knowledge she has for this wonderful industry of ours. Today we have Paisley Witkowski, who is a welding and metallurgical engineer, as well as the VP of Technical Services for the International Welding Bureau. Hey.
Speaker 1:Paisley, how are you doing?
Speaker 3:I'm doing well, and yourself, mac.
Speaker 1:I'm doing good. It is freezing cold here in Regina, saskatchewan, and I know you ran away from Canada a few years back, so you're probably not missing that Alberta cold right now.
Speaker 3:Oh gosh, no, I spent almost 10 years in Fort McMurray, alberta, so I'm not missing the negative 40 degrees at all. It's a balmy like 10, 15 degrees centigrade here in Houston, and that's cold. Yeah, everyone's wearing jackets and layers right yeah, it's crazy big, big uh shift in the temperature here well, we're in the cold snap right now.
Speaker 1:I don't know if you guys watch the weather up here in canada, but like uh, minus 40 would have been nice today. We were minus 52 with the windchill this morning. That and you know those days.
Speaker 3:There's only a few of those a year, but they're real bad I do not miss those days, especially like waiting at the bus stop to go to the refinery and it's negative 50, negative 60, and you get to your office and they're like, yeah, so we got a crack or a leak at the top of a tower and you have to climb it in that temperature super fun.
Speaker 1:Don't miss that at all. Yeah, when, when the grip on your boots doesn't grip anymore, your gloves don't even bend anymore, like it's all just terrible.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you've got like snowflake pain from your eyelashes and you can feel your nose hairs. Yeah, your nose hairs freeze, yeah.
Speaker 1:So, anyways, we gave a little bit about the beginning of your story, but, paisley, let's talk. Let's start at the beginning, right, when are you from? Where do you call? Where's your roots?
Speaker 3:Awesome. Well, I'm from a very rural farming community in Ontario. It was called Vanessa Ontario. It's close to Port Dover. If anybody's familiar with that Like and if you're not, it's about an hour and a half southwest of Toronto, toronto. If you don't, it's about an hour and a half southwest of Toronto, toronto if you say it correctly. And yeah, I grew up out in a farming community. I always joke around that I was one of the best hoes that they had, because that was one of my first jobs was hoeing fields.
Speaker 3:Believe it or not.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. So what kind of agriculture did you guys have there? What kind of farm?
Speaker 3:I work predominantly in like produce, so tomatoes, peppers, peas, watermelons, um, you know, basically whatever we grew apples, the whole works.
Speaker 1:Beans, you name it and you know, in a rural community there's kind of this um mentality that everyone has to pull their weight around the farm. It's kind of the way it works right oh yeah, so I find that a lot of people that come from rural backgrounds are connected to the trades, kind of inherently would you say that that's true for you, or? Or how did you find you know the your your journey into the trades?
Speaker 3:yeah, so definitely I agree with you. 100 like there's no. Oh well, I'm tired. I'm taking a break on the farm. That don't happen.
Speaker 3:Suck it up, buttercup yeah get back um, but my stepfather was actually a foundry worker um, so he was at a casting mill um and that's kind of how I got introduced to that and my father has both mechanical and electrical engineering background, so I've always been kind of inherently around it but never really took a major interest until, you know, once I start going to school. But I've always been a I call myself a tinker fairy, like Tinkerbell. I've always been a tinkerer. I've always sat there and gone through and tinkered with things and pulled things apart. And there's Scotty going behind me pulled things apart and try to put it back together and the whole work. So that's kind of the initial break off, do it?
Speaker 1:now in terms of you know your, your desires. What was young Paisley dreaming of doing? You know, when you were coming up, you know, entering high school, people start asking you what are you going to be when you grow up? What were your thoughts at that point? Well again, I've always been around.
Speaker 3:You know, entering high school, people started asking you what are you going to be when you grow up? What were your thoughts at that point? Well, again, I've always been around, you know, still working, and all that. My father used to drag race, so I used to love, you know, going to the drag shows. I was like like I'm going to become a mechanic.
Speaker 3:That's going to be the coolest job in the world. I'm going to become a mechanic. It's going to be so awesome. And my stepfather was like, hey, well, like you know, you got a little something going on up here, Not a whole lot, but a little bit. Why don't you try something else? I said, OK, maybe I'll look into this engineering thing. That seems kind of cool and it was very interesting because I was never a very academically smart person. Per se.
Speaker 3:Always a very hard worker, but never top of the class. So once I saw this engineering thing thing I was like, oh well, I gotta get there, I'm. And I started off thinking okay, automotive engineering, that's gonna be the bee's knees. I get the best world of mechanics and cars and I still get to do additional stuff too and do more engineering stuff, which at the time I had no clue what that actually meant. So I'll be very honest yeah, but it's it's.
Speaker 1:It's a good pick in Ontario, where the automotive sector has been boss for 50 years, right? So I mean you really can't put a stick into that and say that it's bad, right? Sounds like a good choice all around.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, it was awesome. I went to school in Windsor, which is border to Detroit. You know where the big three three are so it just totally made sense. Um, and then from there and I'll kind of segue into it I uh found my way out into a co-op or an internship. Um, totally by fluke, I was just shooting resumes out left, right and center and all I had was farm work on my resume.
Speaker 3:Professional whore yeah, yeah, slave labor and it was really interesting because it was during the high time of oil and for those of you who are familiar and I'm sure a lot of our colleagues and friends and those are listening are familiar with the oil sands up in Alberta, well, they wanted warm bodies, they didn't care who was coming. I'll be very blunt about it and so I threw my. I'll be very blunt about it and so I threw my name in the hat, forgot about it. And I was out working on the farm over one summer and some person from Suncor called me up and I'm like what the heck is this Suncor?
Speaker 3:Like what is this and they're like hey, can you do an interview? I was like sure, I guess so. And that's how I kind of got introduced into the oil sands.
Speaker 1:So what was your degree? In mechanical engineering or automotive engineering. You know what was specifically. What did you study?
Speaker 3:So I studied mechanical engineering. After I completed my internship, I switched from mechanical engineering with a specialization in automotive to materials or metallurgy in particular, and automotive to materials or metallurgy in particular. So my technical education is mechanical engineering with a specialty in metallurgy, so you kind of got a little extra courseware, so to speak, or whatnot. I'm heavily involved in metallurgy and I love it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, that sounds like the right path to take to get into to northern Alberta. I mean, at that time you know, know, we're talking early 2000s here this is like the boom of of the of alberta, because alberta has always been oil rich I mean, western canada has kind of always been oil rich in general but there was like finally, like the heavy investment to get it out right, like, yeah, let's, like, okay, now let's, we're going to be serious about this, we're going to invest in infrastructure, refineriesies, pipelines, and let's get, let's get it out Right. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Now you get the call out there and what are you thinking? Because, moving from Southern Ontario to Northern Alberta, let me tell you, I know these places well. They're not the same. They're not the same, right I tell you. Yeah, same, they're not the same, right I tell you. So what were your initial thoughts of, you know, a rural girl, woman?
Speaker 3:from southern ontario moving up to northern alberta. I will I'll preface this with. I've always been a risk taker and I'm kind of like as you met, sometimes completely off the rails. I've always been way, even since I've been a child. And. I will never forget this. I think we had like $283 and some odd cents in my bank account. I bought a one-way plane ticket and packed my one suitcase and carry on which I don't know. I think about it now. I'm like I could fit just my shoes in one suitcase.
Speaker 3:Yeah, packed my suitcase, got off at the airport and, uh it, it was the old airport at the time, so there wasn't much there there was a really nasty old subway and a chunk chunk, chunk, chunk, chunk luggage thing and I got off and I had no idea where to go, what to do, and I stepped out. And there's, for those of you who who've been in Fort McMurray and near the oil stands, there's a very particular smell of the oil. Very, very particular smell, especially in the extraction world.
Speaker 1:That bitumen smell.
Speaker 3:What is that? And I was like couldn't figure it out obviously for the longest time, got in the taxi, went to our housing location and, very fortunately, at that time again, everybody was pretty heavy on the oil money, so everything was all paid for, aside from the plane ticket. I had to buy the plane ticket and I just showed up and unpacked my suitcase and sat there and they had a little welcome pack and I was like, oh, I gotta take a bus.
Speaker 3:nice, that's cool, because I had no idea how I was gonna get to and from like I had no idea I was like, okay, perfect, I can find the bus stop, um, and I just looked out the window and I very vividly remember again for those of you who are from the west um, a massive, like raven came and sat on the balcony and it scared the out of me they're huge they're massive.
Speaker 1:They're bigger than dogs oh yeah, and it's just looking at me and I'm like, oh my gosh and they're like, as smart as a human, they're freaky, they like. Look at you and you know there's intelligence behind those eyes oh, totally, they're just.
Speaker 3:They just look right into you and I was like, okay, well, I guess we're here, sat on the sofa and waited to go to work the next couple days awesome.
Speaker 1:I mean, that's an omen. That's an omen. A big raven at your window. Ravens usually don't get that close to you. Usually you can tell when there's a raven nearby because all the birds stop chirping right, like all the birds are chirp, chirp, chirp, chirp and then everyone goes silent that's a raven yeah, they're like, I'm here now.
Speaker 1:Everyone shut up, right yeah, yeah, but exactly that next morning, you know, you get up, you put on your boots, you put on your work clothes, you get on the bus. Did you have any clue what you? It was expected that you were going to be doing that day absolutely no idea.
Speaker 3:I knew we were doing an orientation. All the co-op students have been kind of gathered and it was. It was really neat, honestly. Um, they had put us all in this one condo building and they're all two bed, two bath condos and it's full of, like, university and college students, right, that don't have to pay for living accommodations. They have a cleaner that comes every every week and we all showed up on the bus. Nobody knew anybody. You know there's like that awkward. You're all sitting at the bus. Stop being like. I know you're also like me, but like I don't really like and where are we?
Speaker 3:going. Yeah. Get on this bus and then you start chatting with people. Again, I'm a very social, social, butterfly, friendly person. I'm like hey, so are you a student? They're like yeah, I'm a student. I'm like cool, all right, where are we going? They're like I already told us to get on this bus. I'm like, all right, well, here we are, let's go. We all pile off. And they had some cute little welcome bags and I'm like oh, it's like a birthday party. How fun is this? This?
Speaker 3:is really exciting. I get a condo for free, I get to take the bus for free and they're giving me a little birthday welcome bag.
Speaker 3:That's a swag bag right off the top, yeah, yeah yeah, swag bag, and then it finally you line up and then they start going over the orientation and that was my really first. Uh, that couple days was my first aspect of like real safety training. I had never in my life had really safety training, other than the scare factors that we had when, like the farmers, like the big-time farmers, would come and like, put a carrot in like a piece of machinery and be like that's your finger don't put your finger in things.
Speaker 3:So it was a very different approach to things and it was very fun and uplifting, if you will well, they really tried to.
Speaker 1:I mean, we still try to make safety be more inherently, um, natural and less you know, like if you, if you stay on it all the time, then it's less of a big deal. But I remember the first time I started taking safety training and I was thinking about my dad being like my dad, don't do none of that stuff like safety glasses.
Speaker 3:What's that? Aren't they their regular glasses do the same thing no, that's why you blink right and move fast yeah exactly, exactly.
Speaker 1:So you get to the job and what's the learning curve like? Now you know, like you start figuring out the expectations of your life, of your job were you in for it?
Speaker 3:Was it good, get everything from these like you know horrid closets that gosh knows how long they've been sitting there and dust and this and that and putting everything into a computer program. And there was myself and another student that was in that kind of role and other students in other groups and I remember thinking, okay, cool, I got this easy. You know copy paste typey typey, read typey typey and then like a month in I'm like okay, I'm bored, like what else you know like, and they're like no, no, no, no this is gonna be like years of this yeah, I'm like what?
Speaker 3:like this is not fun at all, and they're like no, no, well, like you know, you're doing really good. You're like your numbers are great and I'm like oh, what about the other kids? They're like well, the kid members are okay. And I'm like okay so I had deviated a plan being like hey can, if I get this much done, can I go try this other like engineering work, all of the other students are doing these like cool jobs, if you will, and obviously the grass is always greener on the other side.
Speaker 3:Blah, blah and they're like hard. No, I was like okay, cool, cool. So I sat there and looked at how many input like pieces of equipment, the other student and I just did 30% more every day and had all of this excess time.
Speaker 3:So, I start popping around and asking the other students what they were doing and this and that, and start get a little in, a little bit of information and we all talk. So I'm like, oh, this RIK thing seems cool. It just stands for replacement in kind. Nothing fancy, nothing super technical, something's broke, worn out, whatnot, what have you, and it's lasted long enough, so we'll replace it with the exact same thing. And you kind of had to put together a little scope of work or an engineering package, how to go through things. So meanwhile I'm getting all my data entry points in and in between trying to do these RIKs. And again, data entry not very fun. Riks at the time was super exciting.
Speaker 1:Compared to the data entry.
Speaker 3:I got to go talk to these people called inspectors Wow, what is that? That's cool. Um, and so my manager caught wind of it and it was like, hey, no, you're supposed to be doing data entry. And I was like, well, I've been doing way more production than this other kid he's like, or no data entry. So, me being me and I'm a very flamboyant person I was like, okay, cool, I know how to play this game. Every time I watched his count and it sounds terrible and I hope you're not listening.
Speaker 3:I'd watch his calendar and when I know his meetings were or this or that, then I'd go and do my work. Come back from Christmas break, do negative 50, negative 60. Super fun. Did not have appropriate clothing at the time either. I remember going and buying my first winter jacket and be like 600.
Speaker 3:Oh my god yeah, but you, you need that 600 jacket though yeah, well worth it yeah and um, I came back, my manager came in and was like, hey, we gotta talk. And I was like, oh, I'm getting fired. Oh, no, I'm getting fired. Apparently, one of the other managers that I've been helping out with the other students caught wind of me doing this, maintaining my job, doing my other stuff, and was like, hey, uh, we need a student to help us out on this thing called a turnaround. I was like what?
Speaker 1:do you mean shut down time?
Speaker 3:yeah, I was like I have no idea what that is, but count me in, do I still have to do the data entry? And he said no and I was like double count me in so that's how I got introduced to the turnaround world. Um and from there it was just exciting. I was running around doing prop work, walking down jobs and again, like at the time, it was the coolest thing ever do.
Speaker 3:I think walking up and down pipe racks now is super fun, no, but at the time it was the coolest thing well, new, it's new, right, it's all new yeah, and you don't know what's what's here or there, and you know designing different um configurations and I remember very clearly I I had designed a configuration for some piping and I think it was the execution manager, somebody from execution and he came in and like pounded on my desk Are you Paisley? I'm like yeah, and he's like get your boots on, do you know how to tie your boots? And I'm like, yeah, I know how to tie my boots. What are you talking about? Come with me. I me. I'm like, okay, permit office, sign in. And uh, he's like got papers in his hand and I could tell that they were my papers and I was like, oh, that's my, that's my job scope and he's like, oh, I won't uh, elaborate on the words that he used for it, but it wasn't very positive and he's like do you have a measuring tape?
Speaker 3:I'm like, yeah, I got a measuring tape. He's like measure here. And I'm like, okay, he's like measure here to here. And I'm like okay, and like halfway through I ran into a structural beam right and typical engineering moment where, like, what you drew will not work yeah, it's like how the am I supposed to put a goddamn pipe through this?
Speaker 3:and I'm like, oh, around it. And he's like I can't just do that, I need it lined out. And it was a very eye opening moment for me because you got to sit down and walk everything through and like it was a very intense moment.
Speaker 3:Fortunately I've had that experience from my farming days. I do remember talking to some other students that had not been from the farming background and kind of lived in I don't want to say bubbles, but more friendly childhood so to speak, and had never been, you know, yelled at and dressed down, yeah. So I was like oh yeah, I should probably like look at every single detail, and that's what I did.
Speaker 1:Well, turnarounds, or shutdowns as people call them. There's a magic in the air, right? Because everything's about to hit the fan. But everyone knows it's about to hit the fan, right, it's like you're planning to throw the poop into the fan and figure out how to fix it, because things are already broke. Things are going to get upgraded, things haven't been working for a bit and you got two weeks to rip everything apart. But while you're ripping that apart, hey, let's do all these 300 other things at the same time, right? So it is a really crazy time when the iron workers show up, the pipe fitters show up, the boiler makers show up, the millwrights show up. Everyone's there electricians, everyone, and it's like giver you got.
Speaker 1:you got two and a half weeks or three weeks, whatever they say it's going to be, and scaffolds go up and then it's go time and uh, it's uh. I loved doing it when I was younger for a while. I mean, the money was great, the money's insane.
Speaker 3:Yeah, oh, definitely. And paychecks are great.
Speaker 1:But uh, the my, my body and mind got tired of it and kudos to the people that can do that for their lives, because I I met guys and girls that were on shutdown teams 30 years and still doing it. I was, I did it for maybe 10 and I was like that's it no more yeah, yeah, yeah, it is.
Speaker 3:I like that you put. It has like a magical essence to it because I like I love turnarounds I love turnarounds. If I could do a turnaround every year, I would. My husband is not too keen on me going out and being in the field as much anymore, but I love it like you get. You know it's coming.
Speaker 3:You know it's gonna be a goat rodeo yeah, you know it, you know like you fought so hard to get scope in and they're like now we don't need to do that and you know, as soon as you open the equipment up, it's gonna be fucked up.
Speaker 1:You know it, you know it, and you have a group of trades people waiting to fix it, yeah, and you gotta trust on their skill and their ability and it gets done. It gets done a hundred percent.
Speaker 3:A hundred percent, and if it doesn't get done, it gets done right on night shift.
Speaker 1:I've learned that very well that's funny, because I was always night crew. I was like, oh why these dum-dums leave for me now. Yes, you've done it right do it on night so you're doing some time at sun core, you're up north. How long did you do that for before you decide to bounce to your next gig?
Speaker 3:well, I had at the time I think it was an eight month co-op and I had it extended for just over a year, I believe, went back to school and that's where I had my. Oh my gosh. Like this materials of metallurgy, this cracking corrosion thing is like there's super cool there's something to say about this this is a really freaking cool and be like there.
Speaker 3:And I'll be honest, I've always been a greedy. I like money in my pocket, I like fancy stuff and I was like, ah, this pays way better than the automotive stuff that is way better so finished up that and then I went.
Speaker 3:I um needed to work right away. I didn't have a place to go after I finished school, so I started chunking out resumes and then Suncor hired me right out of school. Like I think I went on like a two week vacation after finals and then went right back up to Fort McMurray to go work and started it all again.
Speaker 3:Were you back in the same area, site, no different site. So I went to, uh, syncrude, which is a little further down, um, and there's some difference in some units or whatnot, and thinking, yeah, yeah, I got this. I love this turnaround thing, um, and initially, what they had, they had already already filled up the two junior engineering positions and I remember my the man, my manager, saying hey, are you, are you okay being like an inspector, like we need somebody to go to the field, and I was like, yeah, of course. Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 3:So I played as a or worked as an inspector. I didn't get my API tickets, because that's just not how the policy goes when you're a new hire, but I worked under 510 570s um and then I was doing a bunch of ut and mt and pt as well, which was really cool. Um, for the non-registered stuff obviously the registered equipment you need proper, proper, qualified and certified people, uh. But it was really neat too, because then I got really the hands-on aspect of like hey, this is how ut is done, or ultrasonic thickness you can do thickness, or this is how you do um surface breaking, crack detection or any of that.
Speaker 3:And it was really you know, yeah, yeah, it was really neat because you actually get to use and I'm very vividly getting handed a set of nunchucks and I'm like what the heck is this for? They're like oh go do mag and I'm like I don't even know what you mean, but after, if you got a pacemaker. You can't use it I then found out you could get the like the electronic yolks, which were way better than the nunchucks yeah, the yolks are easier to use anyways.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I got this whole feel I think a very good feel of how inspection is done, In addition to like and I hadn't even really worked as a true engineer at this point and I got to see how things are built, how things are, you know, repaired. I'd do the follow-ups of the repairs, go through the inspections and have a really hands-on approach, which I think worked really well in coming right out of school Because, again, school is awesome. You know, I learned lots of cool stuff, but most of what I've learned in my career has been after I got that piece of paper.
Speaker 1:Oh for sure. I always tell people that that diploma, that certificate, that's your ticket to the starting line. That's just that there ain't no finish line, you're just. You just got through the prep to get your ticket to get to the starting line.
Speaker 3:And now, now the real race starts right yeah, yeah, that's where that's the real shit happens you know, all those fun calculus classes and this and that which I did not do well in at all before full transparency. Um, you know it's like, oh man, that was like, you know obviously was useful for something, but what I'm doing right now is not useful so how long did you spend in the oil sands in total? Oh my gosh, it was about 10, just under around 10 years or so.
Speaker 1:So 10 years is a serious amount of time. Like you, you're building a life now. Like, are you like buying a house here in Edmonton or in, or in or in Fort Mac, or are you just renting? Like, I mean? What do you, what's? What's the gypsy life of Paisley look like over those 10 years?
Speaker 3:I was just renting renting a condo um and just working like I don't think I ever did 40 hours.
Speaker 3:I didn't know what 40 hours would be like a vacation, like oh my god 40 hours like oh, I don't do 40 hours silly like yeah so no, I just rented and I was like, all right, cool at that time, I'm like, I'm like I'm going to be a lifer, I'm going to like, you know, I'm going to do all the cool stuff. I transitioned, obviously into engineering at that point and I was like I'm just going to help do turnarounds forever and always. We had a like a metals lab on site too, which was superb. Like metrology yeah.
Speaker 3:So we had, like you know, band, all the saws, like you know, uh, we could do micros, macros, like a whole bunch of stuff, which was really cool and I'm like, well, I'm gonna do all this stuff. We had a big shop on there too. We had three shops actually, um, and I was like, yeah, I'll just keep working doing turnarounds, um, and that's that, and I'll just be here forever. No real sight on, you know, buying a house. At the time it was just work, work, work.
Speaker 3:I want to be the best and I was at, you know, at the end and still to this day at some point. No, if something was like messed up, okay, paisley will do it, paisley will do. I was the emergency the fires, the loss of containment, like the crazy, like got it, and that's what I want it to be known for.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, it gives you a niche right. It gives you a, a protected position, because you can't have everyone be a an apple. You know you need a grapefruit here and there to make you know and, and, and that's important in this industry for people that are really keen with climbing the ladder or moving the upper. You got to find a niche that separates you from the rest. I mean, if you don't do that, why would anyone look at you at all?
Speaker 3:Totally, and it's really interesting, especially in, like, the materials or metallurgical realm in the engineering world, especially in the oil sands, is like there is a big ceiling. You can't just become a, like a higher level engineer. The only thing to get more progressed in the corporate ladder, so to speak, is to move into management. I was like I don't want to deal with people, I want to do cool shit, like yeah, I want to deal with. Where are those jobs?
Speaker 3:yeah, yeah and uh, they, I was told very clearly, like you. Just you gotta wait till the other guy dies and in front of him, like you know, there's two or three other people. It's hard to take reason yeah, I just figured I'd just be engineer gal forever and I was totally cool with that and given the same opportunities, that would be very cool if it's still going forward.
Speaker 1:So what happened? You know you say you're 10 years in the oil sands. If I'm doing the math in my head, you already got past the 2008 drop, because 2008 was an ugly drop for oil and for Western Canada. We learned a lot, though, about resource management at that time, because we did get a bit greedy on the bubble. You know coming up and you learned some lessons. Getting greedy on the bubble it happens to all industries. Sounds like. You survived that. You didn't lose your job. You got through that. So what happened? What drove you out of that area?
Speaker 3:So I was. It was Christmas time and I had always worked holidays. I loved working holidays a because hopefully there's not a lot of stuff going on and b everybody's on vacation. So when you want to take your big month-long vacation to europe, everybody's like oh, you covered my christmas and all that, perfect, no problem yeah, it was christmas, christmas time, there's no materials engineers anywhere.
Speaker 3:I am it and I'm like, okay, and we had a pretty significant um leak in one of the we call them off wigs once through hot water generator. I believe I can't remember what it stands for um in my units because I had owned or wasn't responsible for all of the utilities at that time and I'm like, okay, cool, like, whatever typical crack you know, cut her out, repair it, welded up, let her buck, no problem. Anyways, a few days later, an inspector one of my buddies, calls up and he's like, hey, you know that crack. And I'm like, yeah, you get it fixed. He's like, well, we went to go hydro or hydrostatically test it, where you pump it all the water and pressurize it to make sure there's no leak.
Speaker 3:He's like, well, there's like 20 more and I'm like, what do you mean? There's 20 more. He's like, yeah, I'm like that's a problem. And so we get some samples. I try to do assessment and I'm like I can't figure out what this like damage mechanism is yeah, what's happening here? Yeah?
Speaker 3:it's not based off of anything that we have, you know, listed out in our equipment strategies. That, like this, doesn't make any sense. Go through the history there's a bunch of history of this mysteriously happening sometimes not all the time sometimes and I went to my level of capacity and I went to my leader and I said I don't know what else to do. Like, we need to get this thing up and running. We can't leave it down. I don't know what else to do.
Speaker 3:And one of the mechanical engineers had said hey, I know this guy. He works for a consulting company. Give him a call, tell him you're a friend of mine and explain to him what the problem is and he'll be able to help out. Okay, cool, no problem, call up the guy, um, explain him. And he said yep, we've got people that can help with that. Awesome, give a po the whole work. We go through the assessments, do that all song and dance. We figure out a somewhat you know ideology of how to mitigate it and get it up and running, repaired, and all that. I'm like okay, cool, hunky dory, we're done. You know it's midway in january at that point, um and this is like just at the beginning of covid too, I believe 2019 yeah yeah, and he is.
Speaker 3:He's like he calls me up and this guy lives in hawaii. First of all, like, and I'm like geez must be nice. He's like, oh yeah, we do this consulting stuff and we consult all over the world. And I'm like, oh, that's awesome. Like how do I get a job where I live in Hawaii? And just do you know, metallurgical engineering, that's cool. And he's like well, I have a job that you might like. And he's like I have a job that you might like.
Speaker 3:And he's like you're one of the very few engineers that actually has a big personality he's like I could use somebody like you and I was like me, like me, like all your people have like 30 plus. You know 40, 50 years, I kid you not. Some of them are in their 90s. You know experience like what the heck before engineering was even invented yeah, yeah, like there was dinosaurs out and like you gotta be careful for stegosaurs you know you know like the whole thing and um, so I considered it and I said sure, I'll apply.
Speaker 3:Did the interviews then and the people were like yeah. So I let my my current boss know and said my leader and said hey, like I'm gonna go and pursue this consulting thing and he was sad to let, like let me go. But he had said and we had talked before, he's like you doing just engineering here, you're gonna be stuck doing the same repairs over and over, and he's like you're already in it. I'm like I, yeah, I can tell you what.
Speaker 3:What area in the react, in the fcc reactor, is going to need repair next I can tell you in the hydra cracker like, and he's like no, if you want to stay technical, that's going to be your best career. So I had moved over and switched out of the you know working for an owner operator and went into the consulting world, which was a total difference. You know, I had always worked for owner operators, always, always. And then switching over to consulting was a very big culture shock.
Speaker 1:That was probably more of a culture shock than moving all the way to from ontario to fort mcmurray, um I could totally see that, but I can also see a similarity there, because when you get into the consulting world, it's like every time someone calls it's a new turnaround, because it's always like a new, what the heck is going on, it's a disaster, this needs to happen. Right now. There's a sense of emergency and a sense of unknown, right. So I could see that still being kind of a part of that. Um, I mean, depending on which consulting world you go into, because there's consulting for, like, oh, my brine lines are not, yeah, pumping the fluid they should pump you know, what I mean and then, and then there's other consulting work which is different, right?
Speaker 1:so you know this consulting company you went to will work for. Did you have to leave uh and like uh, where you were living? Did you have to move, or what was the deal?
Speaker 3:no, it was completely remote. I could live wherever I wanted. Um and again, coming from a rural farming community and then now living in fort mcmurray, that's where my life was. I was, like you know, even though I worked all the time, I had a very close-knit group of friends. So I had stayed there for quite some time, a few, I think, a few months and then I said, do you know what? Like I've always liked calgary, like you know, I've gone on vacation to calgary. Why don't I like move to california? My first choice is vancouver. And then I looked at how much the cost of living was and that was very quickly annexed. My family lived in vancouver for like 20 years.
Speaker 1:I was like what are you guys doing? My mom and dad were out there. My dad was a boiler maker. I mean, as a boiler maker you make enough money, that he's okay. But yeah I think back and I'm like if you would have worked 20 years anywhere else in canada you would have had so much more money but whatever so I was like calgary seems cool.
Speaker 3:So I called and again, this is in the midst of COVID, like COVID's happening, like you know, nobody's working at the refineries, nobody's working, everybody's at home. And I had found a cool condo and did a FaceTime, you know, of a walkthrough and I was like all right. I'll sign the lease, no problem, send it over. And the guy was shook. He's like what do you mean? You signed, please don't even come look at it.
Speaker 3:I was like, no, I'm good, looks cool yeah all the movers, let us go yeah, on the way yeah so I had uh then moved down to calgary, which was another really fun adventure, um coming from fort mcmur, which I'm very familiar with um I just recently watched Landman uh with my husband, which was very interesting because there's a lot of parallels to that town. I've heard that show is really good yeah yeah, yeah, like you know, when they have the patch cafe and I'm like, oh, that's like definitely the brew house like everybody's showing up to the bar.
Speaker 3:No max. Yeah, one coffee shop, you know, maybe two. We started to get a little more later on but, I was like, oh, um. So, coming from, like you know, a refinery town where everybody is somehow associated to the refinery, to a very large city, um, and you know it was it was very eye-opening. It was very lonely at first, I'll be honest, because there's so many people but nobody like really you got to try really hard to make friends because you're not working with them.
Speaker 1:That's right. That's right, all right. Well, this is a great time to take a break for our advertisers because then, when we get back, I'd love to hear about how this adventure in Calgary, you know, took off and how you got from the consulting business you were in now or then to the one you have now. So we'll be right back here on the CWB Association podcast with Paisley. Don't go anywhere, we'll be back after these messages. Looking for top quality welding machines and accessories, look no further than CannaWeld. Based in Vaughan, ontario, cannaweld designs, assembles and tests premium welding machines right here in Canada. Our products are CSA certified and Ontario-made approved, reflecting our unwavering commitment to excellence. Count on us for superior service that's faster and more efficient than market competitors. Whether you're in aerospace, education or any other precision welding industry, cannaweld has the perfect welding solution for you. Visit CannaWeldcom today to discover why professionals rely on CannaWeld for their welding needs. Cannaweld where precision meets reliability in welding. Enjoy peace of mind with our four-year warranty on most machines. Conditions do apply.
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Speaker 1:And we are back here on the cwb association podcast. Thank you so much for staying with us. Right before the break, me and paisley were talking about how she started working, for this new consulting company decided to move down to calgary you know, cow town, as we say out here in the west, and uh, I mean, they don't say that in calgary, they don't like it when you say that, but we say that outside of calgary. But but you know what? What's going on now? So you get a, you get your condo in calgary, you're working for the consulting firm. What's the plan?
Speaker 3:yeah. So a little side mission on that too, with the consulting company. I was, I don't want to say sold, but this ideology, oh, you're gonna do all the you know, metallurgical engineering, all the welding stuff, because I had, you know, basically established a welding program at synchro prior and I, I loved it, loved, loved, loved the welding world. I was like, oh well, I can do this and help all these clients. And I was like, yeah, cool, that's awesome. And then same thing. Back to my very first job. Like well, actually, there's all this paperwork stuff just data, yeah, like almost the same as data entry.
Speaker 3:Doing these, I think wretched documents. But you know, and they're like, yeah, we need all these done, and they kept saying, okay, get this done. And then then you're gonna go do and get this done, and then I was like I know this song and dance not gonna happen so I said you know, what.
Speaker 3:I will take this in my own hands again and start reaching out to the other departments and I was like, hey, I'm a welding engineer, I help with repairs, turnarounds, all that stuff. I know y'all do a lot of turnaround work again having to maintain my regular duties Of doing the not so cool fun consulting work but also getting tidbits Of the exciting stuff. Word got around and I ended up being again silly busy, silly, silly, silly busy. I had tried to justify To the consulting company that welding was like kind of a really big deal and people need welding help.
Speaker 3:No, no, no, welding is just easy, you just get a weld procedure and the welders do it and there's no, you know there's no science behind that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no. Just you know well, it's, it's baked in, it's not? Yeah, it's not not. You can't make a career out of that for me.
Speaker 3:I was like I don't know, it seems to be a big thing. Um, and I, leading you up into this, I there was a very large conference here in the states that was happening, uh, for api, and I said, hey, can I go to this api conference? Like we're sending like 30 people, like I would be an awesome person to go to this conference, and and it was shot down no, no, we have other people going. And I was like, okay, cool, no big deal. And I was a little butthurt, I'm not going to lie.
Speaker 3:I was like like you know, you're sending all these introverted people to a conference Like what the heck?
Speaker 1:And none of them are going to come back with anything useful.
Speaker 3:Send me and I can come back with so much. Yeah, like you know, like we can like I used to sell the farmer's market.
Speaker 3:I can sell tomatoes and peppers to anybody, let alone engineering services. Like, well, it's like all right, cool. Well, my mentor, um, who you, I believe, met as well, bill newell, um had said hey, we're having this other conference a few weeks later. It's called the welding summit. Why don't you see if you can come? I was like, okay, cool, yeah, sure. He gave me a discount code and I went to my management and said hey, I know y'all had so much fun or I didn't say y'all at the time because I was still canadian, canadian but I was like oh, you guys had an awesome time in this conference, blah, blah. Like there's this welding one. It's only a couple days. I got a discount code, it's super inexpensive. Like can I go to it? And I remember my manager being like oh, okay, whatever, like let me just throw you a bone. Like I've always done a lot of work.
Speaker 3:I was like okay, and I was one of his favorites. I still don't know why he didn't send me the other conference, but hindsight I'm glad that that worked out. I go to the welding summit. Arriving well, arrive in houston, texas, get off the plane and say, oh my gosh, it's like hot in august yeah, you're plus 30, yeah, like how do people live like this?
Speaker 3:this is wretched. This is terrible. I do not enjoy this at all. All right, show up, check in the hotel and bill texts me. He's like hey, when you get here, come to the restaurant. We've got a big group of people like awesome, cool, you know it's awesome. Go down, drop my stuff off, go down there and I meet bill, who was the first time I actually had met him in person like face to face yeah yeah, plenty of zoom, meetings, teams calls, know what have it, lots of texting back and forth.
Speaker 3:He's been a major influence in my career to date and he introduces me to this table. And there was a very particular person that called himself big sexy, who is now my husband and I enjoyed the conference I learned a lot.
Speaker 3:I met a lot of people. Um, I went back to canada, to calgary, with a whole new outlook saying, no, I was right, there is a massive need in industry for welding people, especially welding engineers or people that have hands-on physical experience, not just engineers that have a cool piece of paper hanging up, you know, um, and so I start, you know, poking and prodding, and poking and prodding and saying what else, what else? And pushing, and uh, um, it was. It's very funny because eventually scotty was like hey, like you know, you're getting kind of taken advantage of, like you're not getting to do a what you enjoyed doing. You're you're not getting paid as much as you could be. You know. He's like you know you're not even enjoying what you're doing. You're up to 2, 3 am every night working, plus you're trying to maintain some sort of life. Like, why don't you come to texas and work? I was like texas, work, what do you mean? Come to texas and work, I'm gonna do, just get up and go to texas. And he's like yeah, why not?
Speaker 2:I was like okay, cool, well, calgary is kind of like mini texas.
Speaker 1:Right, it's not that big of a stretch it is.
Speaker 3:There are similarities. So I had told my my boss and he had a little and I was like, well, I'm gonna do what I want to do. Either I'm gonna work for you or I'm not. So yeah take it or leave it. And he poo-pooed after a little bit and, uh, I moved to texas, still working for the company, um, getting paid in canadian, which was not very fun when you're living in texas um, and then I was like you know what this really isn't working out for me.
Speaker 3:The vibes are off, we're not aligned. I'm not really enjoying it. You're not feeling content. Yeah, so I had switched departments into the mechanical engineering group, so to speak, or department, and it was kind of the same song and dance they're trying to really, in the terms of my old manager, is keep lightning in a bottle, which was kind of positive to hear that, but also negative to hear that, and I was like you know again this this isn't working out um, and I quit I was like no.
Speaker 3:I uh ended up getting a job for a very small amount of time I think it was like two and a half months as a quality manager at a fabrication shop here and, oh my gosh, I would take flickens like no problem in Fort McMurray. But it was not fun doing it the second time.
Speaker 1:You were done with that part of your life.
Speaker 3:I was like I am done with, done with this, learned a lot about the fabrication world but. I always heard about it, you know from the other side, or approved procedures, itps and all that jazz. But um, yeah, I was, like you know what, two and a half months. I think I might have been just under three months. Fine, I'm out, I'm done.
Speaker 3:Peace see you later take my computer. I don't know what I'm gonna do, but but I'm going to figure it out. And that's what I did, that at home for a little while. Fortunately, scott, he was very supportive of that and saying, hey, like you got to do what's good for you. And then I kept getting phone calls. Hey where are you working? Hey, where are you working? Hey, where are you working? Hey, can you help me with this?
Speaker 2:Can you help me with that, Like yeah but I don't really got a job and they're like well, you don't need one.
Speaker 3:He's like and I kept getting calls so and then he's like well, why don't you run your consulting business out of his business? His business and I said well, yeah, well, yeah, okay, well, I just got to cross back into canada and get my visa updated.
Speaker 2:You know obviously a bunch of the additional paperwork, work, visa, blah blah.
Speaker 3:It's not that easy, um, so that's what I did, and then basically got to be my own boss and pick my clients and do what I enjoy. Which fun.
Speaker 1:Now with the amount of work that is in Texas that is welding and metallurgical related. I've seen different numbers but some say that there's more outside of Texas or in Texas, but it's up there. It's big right Now. Do you keep busy enough with consulting work just in your area or are you still picking up like international work or even work in Canada or even work back up in in in the mac?
Speaker 3:yeah, I, I could. If I just wanted to stay on the ship channel, that would be very doable. I, um, I don't understand very selective with my clients but I try not to take on too much because that's just. You know you'll be, you'll detriment yourself. But yeah, I work all over. I still do a lot of stuff back home in canada. Phone calls, this and that reviews go back to site um, I flew up to a few sites, not this last year but prior.
Speaker 3:I do a lot of work up in um, the ohio area, um, and it's a bunch of those refineries, uh, iowa, uh, california, like all over all over yeah so if I wanted to stay busy, I could stay here, but you know what I end up doing and this sounds probably terrible is I try to help my friends out. You know, and I know, and people that are, you know they're not just looking to have a rubber stamp on a piece of paper saying, oh, an engineer blessed this.
Speaker 1:No, I want them to actually have the heart in it for the repair, so to speak Well, and that network is key, right, like you find the people that are always the busiest and have the best careers are the ones that give the most, because it's not just about the job, it's about your relationship with the people within the jobs and even how people talk about you after the fact, right.
Speaker 1:Like once you're gone, people still talk, right. So so you like, I mean you got to. You got to ensure that if you're doing a great job, good, that's fine. You know everyone expects you to do a great job. That's your job. But, what was your attitude during that job?
Speaker 3:What was your give a right like? How much did you put of yourself into it? Totally yeah, like I don't know. I'm a zero or a hundred percent. Like you either get absolutely nothing from me or you get 100. That's not really a middle ground good to know.
Speaker 1:If you don't answer a call, I know you're at zero. That's very much, so yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, right so now, what about?
Speaker 1:you know, like, when I met you, you're at Fabtech. You know I met you at Jason's open house there. I know Jason Scocco back a ways. I've known Bill for a while. There's weird connections that start to happen when you start running into people. Plus you're like I'm from Canada. I was like what are you doing here? You know like, how did you get into those circles? What do you do at Fabtech? What is it that you do now? You know.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm a big supporter and promoter of educating people, both younger and older. In those sense, fabtech I always like going and chit-chatting with people. I help out a lot of our friends and close business relations as well. So fabtech in total while I was there last year was helping out um juvie with tip tag, the tip tag booth, um, and you know, introducing people to tip tag, talking about the productivity, the efficiencies that can do that um, and that was really really neat. I, I really enjoy interacting with people and you're not salesy, by any means, you're like hey, like what?
Speaker 3:do, you do yeah yeah and you talk to people like you know what's what's your issue, like you know this may or may not help you. Like let's talk about it. Um, in terms of like getting with the circles of people and all that definitely scotty and bill have helped out a lot and then, obviously, attending more events.
Speaker 3:I attend a silly amount of things every year, including a bunch of things from AWS, asmi, apis, a bunch of women's network, things, like you know you just got to be involved, astm, you know, and you just show up and hang out with people and chit chat and, like you know, you just got to be involved, astm, you know, and you just show up and hang out with people and chit chat and, like you said, it's really interesting how big but how small the industry is because, you can know so many people and then they know, and other people know other people, and it's like how did you never meet? It's just it's really cool Then when you meet, you're like oh yeah.
Speaker 1:Two ships in the night Right Like well what.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah. So just you know, put myself out there. I think you know it's helpful and I would recommend everybody to do that, even if you're not as extroverted as myself. Like you know, even just showing up and just saying hi to one person Like I've had some very shy students that I've mentored and I'm like all you got to do is show up and just say hi. That's it. That's it, and if that's all you got for the day, good, it's a win.
Speaker 3:Yes, you know, then try to say hi, how are you? And maybe go back to that person the next day. You know, and those, those networks are, you know, invaluable, like you talked about earlier you know, people always remember you for how you acted or what your vibes are. You know you're like your general personality or person, so to speak, not about how smart or cool you are, how many jobs you closed, or this or that. They remember you as a person that's right.
Speaker 1:That's right. And the impact you give? Um, we're all like you know. We all startups. We're walking around with these energies and, at the end of the day, the job is the job, but it's about how you tackle it, how you are, how you leave it the impression. All those things matter in the long run.
Speaker 1:I remember telling young students once about like my resume. When I applied to be a job to teach at the university and I put a job on my resume of a place I got fired from. And when I went for my interview, they're like why would you include a place you got fired from on your for your references? You got a lifetime of of successful jobs, but you pick one that you got fired from to to put on the on your resume. And I was like, did you call them? They're like yeah, and what they say? They said that they made the most money they ever made when you were there.
Speaker 1:And then what happened? Well, you didn't get along with the boss and so you quit or you got fired. You guys had a big fight like, exactly, I'm not ashamed of that. You don't get along with everybody. That happens in life. The job was was great. I loved working there. I made great money for them, we had a great program running, but me and the owner just did not see eye to eye. And sometimes that's life and I'm not going to shy about, I'm not going to hide that from anybody because I am an outgoing personality. I am loud, I am bossy, I can be these things.
Speaker 1:So be aware I'm putting it all on the table here, like I mean be aware, right, yeah lightning in a bottle.
Speaker 3:Yeah right, I think you and I probably have very similar it could burn you but hey, yeah yeah, as long as you're up front, I get that all the time like listen, I'm a lot like. I'm a lot right. I will do you really well. But, like you know, sometimes you, even in your best intentions, you rub people the wrong way.
Speaker 2:I've had it all through my career, oh yeah, for sure my too muchness.
Speaker 3:I don't know how to explain it. Well, I mean, I've had, I think, to get real deep it's like I've had friends in my life where we're best friends for a couple years and I don't see them for like two years and I and I know it's because they had enough of me for a while they're like that's enough of that guy. Yeah, yeah, too much code isn't met. Uh, give me a call back in a couple months. Yeah, yes, exactly so now what?
Speaker 1:what's ahead for paisley? Right like you're young still you know. Right for having such a a storied career and done your time right. You've been in the industry 20 years now, so it's kind of no joke. Or coming up on 20 years. What's the future look like? You know what are the things that interest you now going forward.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so I'm still continuing to consult. I have pivoted a little bit, but still maintaining what I normally do. But I've start, at the advice again of my wonderful mentor Bill Newell, looking into like insurance claims liability, being subject matter expert for technical cases when they go to litigation, which is really, really interesting.
Speaker 1:That's a huge niche that no one is really looking at interesting.
Speaker 3:That's a huge niche that no one is really looking at. It's really wild and, like you know, it's. It's again so very different from working for an owner user, working for a consulting company, working for a fabricator, and it's just this whole other world and it's. I'm very fresh and very green in that um, but it is very, very neat. Um, you got to be very good with your communication skills. I guess which? I've had to learn how to phone back.
Speaker 1:And your documentation is at another level because you got now not engineers looking at it, but lawyers.
Speaker 3:Lawyers? Yes, and it's funny because, even though you think you're getting paid a lot, you know you're the lowest paid person on the job. It's crazy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're not. $500 an an hour no, no, no, um.
Speaker 3:So that's been really interesting. And then, as I mentioned um, we just started up a new company called the international welding bureau, or iwb. I know that there's been some items talking around on the internet. We haven't fully launched yet, but there's kind of two sections, so to speak, of this and the one section that's my baby um and I'm very excited for when I launch it full-time. We're in the alpha uh testing phase. Right now is um mtr reading.
Speaker 3:So material test reports it's basically you can upload a mtr, be a pdf, word, whatever, and it will basically in less than five seconds tell you if that mtr is compliant as me. Section two, alpha or bravo, and the all the asdm associated specifications to them.
Speaker 1:And I am super pumped about that because tool, yeah I was that person having to review mtrs manually and they would be stacks and stacks and stacks and stacks well, every run has their mtrs, every length of the coil has its mtr, every section of pipe cut off has its mtr, like they're everywhere everything, everything that's made out of something is?
Speaker 3:has you know, a birth certificate, so to speak? I'm focusing right now um on metals and filler metals at this moment, um, but yeah, that's. That's that's where I'm going with that. Uh, we're again in the very initial phases um of the mtr portion of the iwb um and we're hoping to have a launch, full launch um in may.
Speaker 1:Um, so it's very I know I'm on the subscription list because I would talk to juvie about it and you know I'm I'm friends with him and trying to figure out what's going on with it because I'm like I'm I've gotten the teasers, I'm on the subscription list but there's been no updates. I just messaged him like two weeks ago, being like what's going on, man? Like I, you told me january back in december. Now it's you, you know we're coming on February. I'm glad it's still moving forward.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and then on the welding side, we're going through the phases of, you know, reviewing and developing the weld procedures for this and kind of going over all the quality manuals and this whole thing. It's it's a lot of work, like the idea is fantastic and how we're going about it. And it's just all the excess paperwork or background work, um takes time, um like, and we're talking, you know, thousands of weld procedures alone oh, yeah, yeah, and there's more every day yeah, yeah, and, like you know, obviously new materials are popping up, you know.
Speaker 3:But the really cool thing about the iwb is, you know, take carbon steel, for example. Um, you know how many people have weld procedures for carbon to carbon? Like thousands, probably hundreds of thousands.
Speaker 3:I know companies that have over 50 carbon to carbon weld procedures just in their shop, yeah yeah, just in their shop, because you know one owner user doesn't like this here, one owner user doesn't like that there, one or user wants this, you know. So this, these weld procedures are going to be approved by all the big owners and users and fabricators etc. And to come to kind of a consensus and be able to utilize basically, I don't want to say silver bullet weld procedures, but very robust weld procedures that will cover, you know, most people's wants, needs and desires that'll still be within scope of all the other accreditation bodies, right, correct?
Speaker 3:correct very much so. So it's, uh, it's. It's very exciting. I'm super pumped. Um, again, things take a little time, but you know I'm full-fledged. We've got a good chunk of weld procedures going through the pipeline right now and we've got a lot of interest from owner-users as well as fabricators, mechanical contractors, for the welding portion of it as well as the MTR portion. So once we do a full launch, we have it. It planned out for may. But you know, give or take some time. Always things pop up.
Speaker 1:I was gonna ask are you gonna have a planned rollout for fab tech in chicago for september?
Speaker 3:I don't know yet, um, but we can talk to all the partners and kind of. That would be super ideal. I'll be honest that's ideal.
Speaker 1:You always want to hit up like the big ones, right?
Speaker 3:yeah, yeah, yeah, you know so, but yeah, that that's what's coming down the pipeline.
Speaker 1:Now that's interesting because, like I know in the US and I think I've worked down there a few times when I was still welding it can be a bit of a dog's breakfast when it comes to standards and codes, Like I mean, sometimes even a two kilometer or three and a half mile walk is. It'll change Like. If you're on the coast, you're under a maritime annex, you walk in a kilometer into the fab shop. Now you're in the AWS world, you walk in then you walk another 20 miles in that direction.
Speaker 1:You crossed over a state line. Now all your certs are out the window and start over, and but not for some. Some you have to retest, not others. Some have to be in shop, not others. Some have to be in shop, not others. It coming from Canada, where it's so standardized up here Like it's so like I get a ticket and you know, in in in a shed in Alberta and it's good across the country, Right, Like that doesn't exist in the U S.
Speaker 1:I can very much see where your, your product and your desire to amalgamate this kind of dog's breakfast into something that makes sense as a concurrent. It would be great for everyone the welder, the fabricator, the shops, everybody. Do you but you. But the title is international welding bureau not the american welding bureau so how do you foresee this being, uh, you know, adopted by very established places like canada, australia, germany, france, switzerland, you know, where they have very robust and solid and accredited, you know, culture standards?
Speaker 3:yeah, very interesting question. So, and again, everything varies, as you said, just with alone in the states. You know, everything can be totally different even in just the state of texas, depending on how the company operates. They may not even care, unfortunately. That's how that round. But then you start going into other states, then, yeah, you might have to go back and retest and this and that. And obviously in Canada it's the same aspect where, like you know, if you go now in Canada, most of the people and I'm going to right now specify in Alberta, both of them are union based right.
Speaker 3:So they've got their ticket and they're still working through the union, so they likely don't have to retest.
Speaker 3:You know, because they went and put a CB and I had on this month and next month they've got, you know, edx or Edmonton exchange or had, and next week they have, you know, a Maloy or what have you, because it's all through the union and they're obviously they need to maintain their continuity and all that stuff. But, um, basically the whole approach is to make sure that you're not going through and adding in additional research, research, research. Now, if people want to take um, join the organization and be a participating member as a fabricator, as an owner operator, as what have you, they have that ability to go through and have their welders test through the IWB and then basically have that similar approach. As you know, the unions have where it's like okay, you've got your ticket as long as you maintain your continuity, and there's a bunch of other additional items, because the whole point of the IWB is to cultivate, you know, the welder, not just to the bare minimum of the code, like these are going to be the whole plan.
Speaker 3:Yes, exactly, and not just me like exceed, and they're going to be crumbs, the crumb welders. It's going to be a very cool thing and a very positive thing to say yeah, I'm an IWB welder, because it's not just bare minimum code aspect and how that is integrated in other countries. I can't specify the direct paths that we have, but we do have a lot of interest currently from Canada and Australia actually, and a few European areas that are quite interested as well. But again it comes down to the actual participating um company in the organization not necessarily just like the, the country or the jurisdiction, so to speak.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay that's super interesting yeah and you know, there there is a push worldwide to to standardize. There is, yeah, because, um, as we've seen with global markets, that if you don't have some form of standardization, it's a real shoot sometimes for buying stuff. Like you know, you get steel from certain places on the wrong time of the year, the wrong month, and you're ordering pipe and it shows up like pigtails. Or you're ordering sheet and you can see the lamination before it's even off the truck and and and you're shaking your head and being like how did this pass any type of qc?
Speaker 3:then you find out well, there wasn't really yeah, like because they're trying to get it out the door, that's right that's right.
Speaker 1:So there there is this desire from the world to standardize, but on the other side of that coin, standardization is extremely expensive which is why you have seen mainly only the rich countries do it the australia's, the canada's, the germany's, the switzerland's. You know, we're the countries that have really set up national standardization, not because it was fun or easy I mean, those are major jobs but because we have the money to do it right yes, and, and the desire to do right you know, obviously everybody wants to go home at the end of the at the end of the day you know,
Speaker 3:um, but these things and it's really interesting. So for a while I sat on the b51 committee through for canada and it was. We were talking about harmonization throughout all the provinces and it's such a really key thing. And again, the amount of, you know, energy to put into not just not just the economics, not just the cost, like the actual energy to go through, because it's similar, you got to throw something at the wall and you know it's going to get shot down and then it's going to have to be reconfigured.
Speaker 3:And this, and you know, even when you get something that you're like, okay as a group, you and this isn't a group of five or six, like groups of like 30 plus- people say, okay, this is how we're going to approach or tackle this issue or problem or what have you. And then you put it in play and it's going to take, you know, oodles of time to evergreen, because it's not. You're never going to get it right. You're never going to get it right.
Speaker 3:And that's where you really got to have the faith of like people, you know and it's all sorts of people from all different skill sets, trade areas, this and that, and to have the desire, because you know, on the flip side, if you go through too much of it, then you've got all of this red tape.
Speaker 1:So you got to really find this. Yeah, the bureaucracy ate the work before it even got done. Yeah, which is something I used to hate when I was a shop owner. It's like you know I could have already built a hundred of these in the time it took for you to approve the damn thing you know, what I mean, and we're all sitting around twiddling our thumbs waiting for this. But you get it.
Speaker 3:This is the process, right like yeah, yeah, like what well procedures alone. I cannot tell you how many times I have reviewed the same well procedure. Nothing's changed.
Speaker 3:Yeah, every year there's only so many contractors that you know I'm going to talk about refinery refineries that owner users of refineries have allowed to do work on their site, and if they just go across the state line or cross the border and it's like that's the same wild procedure, you gotta sit there and you gotta wait so that they send it, and then they gotta wait till they the next person goes and gets in their e-mail and it's for consulting. Then they call me up hey, do you got time to do this? Yeah, okay, cool, they send it over. Then, yeah, I've got a bunch of other stuff. I don just I'm not always able just to drop it right away. Obviously, prioritization, if need be, you do, and then you gotta go through those and update all of this line out all of the issues, or say, no, it's good, and then you usually have questions. So it's like, well, what are you doing? What are you repairing? What's the equipment? What's your jurisdiction? And this could be weeks, yeah absolutely for one simple doc yeah
Speaker 3:send it back. And then they're like no, no, we don't agree with you.
Speaker 1:And it's just like oh my gosh, like yeah, actually we're not going to use that wire, we're going to switch the wire. Does that? That doesn't matter, does it uh?
Speaker 3:like yeah, yeah, actually like. So our sub arc machine is really busy, can we just use Meg? It's like well, you didn't send a Meg procedure over.
Speaker 1:Let's start over you can like.
Speaker 3:I've always had this line. You can do whatever you want. Now is the compliant and responsible. That's another situation.
Speaker 1:That's on you.
Speaker 3:You know I'll be happy to look at your NCR afterwards, no problem.
Speaker 1:Awesome Paisley. This has been a great interview, um, and it's. I've learned a lot already now for yourself. You know, as, as a as a woman in the industry, who's who's done. Well, you don't seem shy, you, you put your foot out there, you pushed where you needed to push. You know, for, for so many of the people out there that are getting, you know, that are shy, or so many women that are kind of tentative about entering these industries, you know what would you say to them? You know, because this podcast is actually going to be released during a women empowerment month. So you know, in terms of empower of an empowered woman yourself, you know what kind of advice would you give to another woman that's thinking about it, or maybe is on the fence, about what they should do?
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I'm going to start with the hard truth first. You will cry, like I cry. I've cried in bathroom stalls. You know it's. It's hard, it's not easy. Like if somebody says, oh yeah, I've had a lovely picnic walk and everything's been great and rah, rah, rah, super awesome. They're lying to you or they've just had a really good experience. Yeah, yeah, um, it's tough, you know, especially if you go to places like fort mcmurray.
Speaker 3:I do believe things are changing, um, and they have changed from when I was there versus, you know, years prior, because I've talked to a few female engineers and inspectors and they're like, oh, this is way much better than it was, it's evolving, but never, like, give up hope, you know. Always just try to push to do the right thing and do be your best version of yourself. Like I have point blank messed up things and been cussed out like no tomorrow. And sometimes it is because you're an easy target. I'm not a very large statured woman, I have a big personality, but I come in a very tiny package. Sometimes, um, you do get people thinking or, you know being, like I can push this around, this one around, she's too friendly, she's too nice, I can just plow through her and you got to be really resilient and, just you know, stand your ground, be open and honest to who you are and in those cases where you're like, hey, this really isn't my vibe, just be honest to yourself. Do I think running at the problem saying, oh you know, we should all be equal and well, you should be treating me that way, blah, blah?
Speaker 3:I don't think that's the best approach. Obviously attack it in a sense where it's like, hey, man, didn't really love what you did there. You know you gotta be a little appropriate for those things. But overall I love what I do. I think it's the coolest job in the world. I gotta be like a CSI agent and a doctor for metal and some very, very interesting places and spaces. And you'll always meet those people where it's like, oh my gosh, you can put your boots on, go women in industry, wow, oh. And then you get the total opposite side where they won't talk to you at all. I've flown back home before because people didn't treat me nice and then I had to fly all the way back and they were much nicer the next time around.
Speaker 3:So it's never going to be a linear path of how you go about stuff. Just be open and honest to yourself and if it's something you truly do I'm a big advocate in the STEM world for women, men, et cetera you just got to enjoy it, because if you don't enjoy it you're going to be miserable.
Speaker 1:Right, that's great advice and you know it's. I want to make a comparison for people here, because I I get tired sometimes of women being embarrassed about crying because in my life and I've worked 33 years in this industry. Now, uh, it'll be my 33rd year, actually this september. That's crazy, but um, and I taught for eight years at the college. I've been around every time a guy throws his grinder, every time a guy acts tough and punches the wall every time a guy freaks out and rips his coveralls or does that?
Speaker 1:that's crying. That's the same every time a dude throws a fit and thinks he's all tough and and macho looking because he wrecked his grinder on the table or smashed his stinger into a million pieces or thrown his helmet across the room. There is no difference between that tantrum and a woman experiencing fear or sadness or or uncertainty and expressing it through crying. That's just the way they're expressing their emotions and I don't like it when dudes freak out and act like babies and throw tantrums. Uncertainty, and expressing it through crying that's just the way they're expressing their emotions and I don't like it when dudes freak out and act like babies and throw tantrums. I actually find it to be the most uncomfortable things when I see a 40 year old man smashing something because he's upset. All I see is a four year old little baby with a soother yeah, right, yeah.
Speaker 1:And and when I see a woman having to go hide cause she's crying, and when I see a woman having to go hide because she's crying, I'm like I would rather the men just cry and deal with it like an adult than smash things like an idiot. Right, yeah, and so. I think that there's something we got to just give up and be like it's okay to have emotions period.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, totally Like. And I always tell people I'm like I'm not crying because I'm sad, I'm crying because I'm frustrated or I don't know what to do and it's like you know, I got really good at pinching the back of my ear or my inner elbow just to help suppress it. But it's exactly like you said, it's just an emotional outburst, you know, and there's different ways to do that and, like you know, it happens and again, it may not because you're sad. It's like I don't know what else to do.
Speaker 3:And I'm not going to go smash something because I don't want to. You know, have to deal with the pieces afterwards.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think guys are like told, since they're young, oh, it's okay for you to act like that. Well, actually no bro.
Speaker 3:Not really. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you got to like dial it back and sometimes you can't Take your five go for a smoke, go for a walk.
Speaker 1:Let's not, let's you know, like you said, dial it back. And if you want to have a good cry, dude, go have a cry in your vehicle. I used to work for a shop and I hated working there so bad I'd have to like pull over on the side of the road on the way to work to cry Cause. I didn't want to cry at work.
Speaker 1:I'd like cry. I'd like pre-cry, I, I'd like pre-cry. I'd pre-cry before I got to work so no one would see me, right? And but then that was the type of job where I'd lose my temper and I'd be frustrated all the time. And then I realized, like this job might be a great job and my work is fantastic what I'm doing, but mentally for me it's not a fit. Right. So, and you got to look after yourself.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally, yeah, yeah, totally. Like we did a high school welding competition on the first of February and there was an instructor there and she came over and she was like I would love you to come talk to my kids, because all they get told is, oh well, you're a girl, you can go into nursing or education and it's like no, like engineering is so cool, welding is so cool, like you know, inspection is cool.
Speaker 3:There's so many different opportunities out there and that's just like oil and gas, like you could do, rockets you can do you know buggies you could do mining everything yeah anything but you gotta, you gotta a know what it exists, or at least have a path to figure it out and b. Enjoy it like you know. If you don't enjoy it like you're saying, you're just gonna be miserable. It's not a fun time. We spent a lot of time working like a lot of time working.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we do. It's got to be at least neutral. At least neutral, hopefully positive. But I'll take neutral.
Speaker 3:Yes, yeah, yeah, neutral or above.
Speaker 1:Exactly, all right, basically, well, thank you so much. Any shout outs or anything you'd like to say to the people before we end this interview.
Speaker 3:Oh, I think I would cover it pretty good. Just, you know, find what your passion is and, like you know, welding's cool shit. I love it, like it's like the coolest thing. You know. I'm gonna work with metal and I don't have to deal with blood, which is good. So keep, keep at it. And if anybody has any questions or comments or wants to reach out, I'm completely available. I'll give you my email and my social media as well. Feel free, I'm always down for a chat.
Speaker 1:Awesome. Well, thank you so much, and when we release this podcast, guaranteed we'll have that information there at the podcast. Are you planning on being at Fabtech again in Chicago this year?
Speaker 3:I have to look at my schedule. I know I've got lots of commitments and stuff, but I am hoping to, so I haven't committed to it yet.
Speaker 1:We just booked our rooms and got started planning it just this week, so if you're there, hopefully see you there. If not, I'm sure I'll catch you somewhere else. We're going to be doing some work down in Houston this year, I think coming up, so maybe I'll come visit.
Speaker 3:Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1:Awesome. Well, thanks a lot and take care.
Speaker 3:All right, you too.
Speaker 1:And for all the people that are following and listening. Thank you so much for being a part of the podcast. May keep downloading, sharing and commenting. We have a new fan mail feature, which we are getting some silly. Some of them are great. Someone did ask what's the furthest I've ever gone for a welding job and the answer to that was Takaradi, Ghana, in Africa. So that's the furthest I've gone for a welding job that was in a gold mine. I was there for three months on the first turnaround because I was there for a turnaround and the next turnaround was a three-week turnaround for them. So it was fantastic. So keep the questions coming, Love them and we'll see you at the next episode. Take care, we hope you enjoy the show.
Speaker 4:You've been listening to the CWB Association Welding Podcast with Max Cerullo. If you enjoyed what you heard today, rate our podcast and visit us at cwbassociationorg to learn more. Feel free to contact us if you have any questions or suggestions on what you'd like to learn about in the future. Produced by the CWB Group and presented by Max Serron, this podcast serves to educate and connect the welding community. Please subscribe and thank you for listening.